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MG Midget and Sprite Technical - excessive wear on green pads

Hi all FWIW, just changed to standard gold pads hoping to cure lack of stopping ability, horrified to see the amount of, and erratic/uneven nature of wear on the old green ones. Considering these had done only 300 easy miles they wouldn't have lasted very long, the pad at top right is showing excessive wear and others have some "chunking", maybe hard to see in the pic. Anyway new golds, properly bedded in exactly according to the 4 step process, have alreday shown an improvement. BTW all this with new rotors(drilled and slotted) and calipers(standard) Cheers Rod

R W Bowers

Hi I have just put greenstuff pads and new matching rotors om my car, less than 500miles so far.
they seem very good so far, but i did get some brake fade the other week whilst testing brakes after fluid change.

i'll keep my eye on it,, reading previous posts and also on other forums some people are happy with them and some prefer the mintex ones...
Andy Phillips (frankenfrog)

When I last used greenstuff about 10 years ago they initially felt good compared with OEM. I gradually realised if was fooling myself! MIntex1144 every time for fast road sprint and trackday. Not sure about the discs though?..
Dan Cusworth

I have used Greenstuff pads for around 10 years with no problems at all. But l may try Mintex when next replacing just for variety.

Rod, are you sure yours were genuine? Sort of item l would imagine is just too easy to counterfeit, with a decent mark up to make it worthwhile.
Guy W

Hi Rod,
Guy's put my first thought at seeing that photo (we so often think alike but not so often in-tune with each other)

I've no idea if there's a suggested running-in/break-in method for these Green-Stuf pads but they're not designed for easy miles use

as I put before if there are any numbers on them I can see with EBC if perhaps they're very old stock

as I put before drilled and slotted (grooved) discs on a Spridget seems a bit over the top to me you don't get them on heavier cars with more performance than a Spridget

I not sure what standard gold pads are other than just standard pads perhaps, I've never used Green-Stuff owning to my mate at Padgid but I've used generic standard pads and currently use Mintex 1144 which I'm happy with
Nigel Atkins

Thanks lads, the rotors came with a job lot of bits and pieces, brand new so I used them. There is no sign of wear on the rotors. Did a nice 50 mile run on sunday, brakes are fine, not spectacular, but acceptable. Will check serial numbers on box of new green pads I have (unused) against worn ones. BTW I have 1 slightly used and 1 new set of green pads for sale LOL Cheers Rod
R W Bowers

not change those old tyres yet then? ;-)

btw - by Padgid I meant Pagid, before anyone comments
Nigel Atkins

Nigel dear chap, who needs a wife when I have you to nag me, LOl, this week a set of 165x75x13's go on, of eastern manufacture but no option. keep you posted, cheers
Rod
R W Bowers

Rod,
the quicker you get new tyres on the quicker you can report the improvement and I can think to myself I told you so and have that warm feeling of smugness I so much enjoy

remember to take it easy with the new tyres at first in case they're 'greasy' and to check the torque on the wheel nuts after about 30 miles

and always use your handkerchief and not your sleeve especially if wearing a short sleeve shirt
Nigel Atkins

Nigel, after consulting carbible Tyres, I'm horrified to find my tyres are, gasp, 7 years old. keep you posted Cheers
Rod
R W Bowers

lack or little use doesn't help them either

unless you're buying some ditchfinders I think you'll be surprised just how far off the mark your present tyres could be, course you'll soon get used to the new tyres and forget how the compared to your present tyres

just look what you found when you took the pads out ;)
Nigel Atkins

I have Greenstuff pads with grooved discs and have found them to be better than standard both in braking effort and reduced brake dust. Had them on for a couple of years.

Bernie.
b higginson

Greenstuff pads on my MGB V8 make the front wheels filthy after about 100 miles. But they seem to bite alright and have done 16,000 miles so far, only appearing half worn.
Mike Howlett

that's interesting Bernie and fair enough, Rod should have it made then as he has drilled and grooved discs

were you comparing new Green Stuff pads and grooved discs to new standard pads and discs with no other changes to the braking system (rather than worn pads and discs)?

I've no doubt your system would be better than standard just that if the standard braking system is wholly in good condition and good quality tyres in good condition then for a standard road going Spridget the standard braking system is adequate - but can be improved if wanted or required
Nigel Atkins

Another vote for Mintex1144s here!
Matt1275Bucks

Nigel. When I finished my car about 5 years ago it had brand new calipers, standard discs and pads. It was OK until about two years ago when I started to get brake judder from warped disc, so I changed the discs for grooved ones and the pads for Greenstuff. The discs were from the internet and the pads from Moss. I noticed an immediate improvement in braking effort and less dust. I think it's a fair comparison as the original discs/pads were in good condition. I wonder if the grooved discs help where the dust is concerned because my experience is completely opposite to that of Mike.

Bernie.
b higginson

fair enough Bernie, I must admit I'd love pads that didn't soil the front wheels after one brisk run

just out of interest have you a rough idea of how many miles you done in those 3 years (for the disc to warp and) were the pads new 5 years ago or stored during a long restoration?

Nigel Atkins

About 4000 miles and the pads were bought new just before I fitted them. I was disappointed but not really surprised that a disc had warped so soon, I put it down to them being of inferior quality. I'm pretty sure it was the disc because the new discs are OK and I'm using the same bearings.

Bernie.
b higginson

cheers

I'm not doubting you just trying to gauge how much improvement the grooved discs and Green Stuff pads give, any chance the previous pads could have been of poor quality too?
Nigel Atkins

Both discs and pads from Moss. I suppose Moss must sell stuff of dubious origin just the same as any other company supplying pattern parts. You should have seen the Austin Healey bonnet badge they wanted to sell me, I wouldn't have put it on my car even if it were free!
b higginson

Bernie,

Did the discs actually warp or was it a matter of a rusted spot from lack of use. I had to change the discs on my Lancia Delta a couple of times as the discs got rusty spots were the pads had stuck through lack of use and they didn't clear with use and gave a bad judder.
David Billington

Dave. No it was warped. I had it checked on a friend's disc skimming machine. But I agree, build up of rust and dust deposits can give the impression of a warped disc. I didn't have the discs skimmed because I had been thinking about grooved discs for some time.

Bernie.
b higginson

low quality, of parts, Shirley not !

cheers Bernie
Nigel Atkins

Hi lads, when I go out on my own I give it a good solid run with some hard breaking. I only changed the pads to see if I could improve the braking, not sure if I have, hopefully these very carefully bedded in "Gold standards" from Moss will get better, if not it's a set of Mintex1144's?. Cheers Rod
PS I had virtually no dust, just the uneven wear on the pads PPS Nigel still looking at tyres maybe Toyo's?? any clues??
R W Bowers

well Rod I think you might be yanking my chain a bit as the 'tyres' thread on this forum covers Toyo 350 at least

generally though any new tyres are going to be better than old and/or lack of use or worn tyres, I'm not sure you need 165 but don't know what's actually available to you (as opposed to advertised)

with your brake set up I'd have thought 215 would be a minimum width !!

seriously if you can get the Yokohama A.drives 155/70/13 or 165/70/13 I don't think you'll be disappointed, don't spend any more money on brake pads (as you might not need to) until you've bedded in your new tyres -
http://www.yokohama.co.nz/product_chart1.php

http://www.yokohama.co.nz/a_drive.php
Nigel Atkins

Hi Nigel definitely last post, only mentioned TOYO's as I have just picked up their warehouse training account and can probably get them straight from the warehouse. Yes did read the "Tyres" post, not really yanking your chain. However you lads have access to stuff we can't get, the markets not big enough.
Cheers
Rod
R W Bowers

Rod,
you noticed I put the Toyo 350s were not bad tyres just not suited to a Spridget

I've had Toyo performance tyres on various cars going back many years and generally they are very good

Toyos UK (headquarters IIRC) used to be 20 miles away so we had good coverage in this area

I've also had a various Yokohama performance tyres over the years and again generally they are very good too

it's a matter of getting the right make and model of tyre to best suit the car and its use (and you) and that's not always popular or well know makes
Nigel Atkins

I may be talking bullsh!t here, but I believe that it is not realistic to apply experience of tyres from one market to another. The tyre compound can (and is, seasonally) altered in the factory at the flick of a switch. So it seems to me unlikely that a tyre sold for use in Australia with mean summer temps of around 30C is going to be the same compound as one sold for the UK temps of 10C - if you are lucky!

I use Toyo 330, and liked them. But that tyre has now been replaced by Toyo with their 350, which Nigel doesn't like. Is this because of a change in tyre, or is it because Nigel and I have different opinions? But if my surmise about differing tyre markets worldwide is correct, then neither opinion is of much use in advising Rod in Australia where they are likely to be a different compound and to perform differently anyway.
Guy W

Guy,
I think you have a good point but all these things are a generaliation anyway, it's just trying to get a closer perspective from the same make and model of car but then there are still numerous differences and variations but it's just a matter of narrowing down the selection to a reasonable size

I put about personal driving tastes and styles for tyres which again are other generalisations and even more variables

the tyres mentioned for Rod are available in New Zealand and if adjusted for that market then the blurb in their catalogues is similar within the range of each model of tyre

Rod still may(?) be able to get the 330s you're happy with but they do vary from the 350s I'm not happy with - http://www.toyo.co.nz/tyres.php?Category=Passenger

small changes in car or tyre manufacture could make a big difference, I had (IIRC) a set of Yokohama A509/510(?) on a car and they were brilliant but on the next car a year later that was the same make and model except slightly different suspension the same tyres I was very unhappy with and changed them after trying different suspension settings for a 1,000 miles and wished I'd changed them a lot sooner - unfortunately I can't afford to do things like that anymore

it could be that a second or third league tyre could generally be the best for Spridgets but no one has tried them or reported on them

then of course there's the fashion of tread patterns, who wants to be seen with last year's tread pattern !!!!
Nigel Atkins

Exactly Nigel. Too many variables as it is without adding in different market specifications as well. And you can't even rely on brand reputation either. Pirrelli used to be considered one of the best brands but l gather they don't wear so well these days and also are not very puncture proof either.
Guy W

Guy,
you're going back a long, long way for Perelli being good let alone 'the best' (for what), they certainly weren't when we had a Fiat in 1996, sidewalls were cracked within 18 months

unless you can sample the all the possible tyres on your car you can only go on current information, the subject of tyres is covered regularly and a selection offered up each time

unfortunately I've not seen a replacement for the Yokohama A.drives yet

just realised I've put links to New Zealand instead of Australia, apologises Rod (if you're still reading this) (someone was in NZ for tyres but I can't remember who now)

so yes sorry forget about Yokohama A.drive for Australia (unless they import from NZ!)

Toyo Aus, 330 and 350 shown - http://www.toyotires.com.au/tyres/passenger-family.htm

Nigel Atkins

Nigel. The Pirrelli reference was a joke.
Guy W

well Pirelli were often said by many to be good tyres

I was also thinking that it's obvious that Toyo and Yokohama aren't British as their summer tyres IIRC lose their efficiency at 10 degrees and below so more high summer tyres
Nigel Atkins

Nigel the joke was regarding Pirelli performance and Formula 1, re last weekend.
Guy W

Well there is a 800 pound horny goat in the room.


Everyone is talking about green stuff vs minix

But what about ceramic pads...they seem like a good choice, they take longer to heat and cool faster so they signifagantly reduce fade, they wear longer and not near the dust and the dust is white and maintain a good grip even in wet weather

Prop
Prop and the Blackhole Midget

Ok definitely my last post, yes still listening thanks all for the info. FWIW just put a set of really cheap (40 quid each) tyres on the wife's seldom driven Mazda. (replacing a set of Pirelli "dragons"
-absolute sh*te BTW) They are brilliant, they also have a size to fit the "gidget" HMMMM???? methinks maybe worth trying!
cheers all
R W Bowers

Guy,
you beat me to it, I saw the local news last night where the track was being blamed for the punctures

Rod,
the less the car is used the more it'll need good tyres - and I'm not saying that £40 tyres can't be very good tyres, any new tyre should be better than a worn or old and little used tyre

Prop,
Rod's got enough front brakes to stop his and the Spridget behind now he just needs a set of new tyres to giving the braking
Nigel Atkins

+++++Prop,
Rod's got enough front brakes to stop his and the Spridget behind now he just needs a set of new tyres to giving the braking++++++

Im pretty much convinced there is no such thing as enough brakes...it can always be better

I cant wait to install my mgb calipers on sloted drilled spitfire rotors with mgb v8 hd white ceramic pads... the pads are almost 70 % bigger then the standard midget pad, and thats on top of my duel tilton master cly set up with All the pipes converted to stainless steel braided brake line on AN air craft fittings...Truely insane!!!



Im hoping for 60 to Zero in 18 inches....hahaha

Prop
Prop and the Blackhole Midget

An impressive set up Prop. Should certainly stop your wheels from going round pretty well instantly. Not quite the same as stopping the car though is it? ;-)
Guy W

How about a parachute and an anchor too? That might help once you've locked the wheels. :).
Lawrence Slater

I think Prop may have it ass backwards. To make the investment in better brakes worth it he surely first must have some thing to get the car to move forwards, ie a working fitted engine.

Bernie.
b higginson

Bernie...im trying to buy a mule to pull the car...hahaha

Yeah it should be an interesting experiment to say the least, next ill have to find some sticky tires to complete the effect

TBH.. I doulbt it will stop all that much faster and shorter distance...but I think ill get X8 more in brake pad long lasting wear

Prop
Prop and the Blackhole Midget

This thread was discussed between 23/06/2013 and 02/07/2013

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