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MG Midget and Sprite Technical - Fanbelt removal

Poking around under the bonnet - as one does when the kids get too much - I noticed that the crankshaft pulley driving the fanbelt has some sort of sheathing/guide/whatever fixed next to the actual pulley itself - see photo - dark metal annulus/ring with a small nick in it.

No idea why this is there - possibly a balancing weight for crtankshaft?, but the problem is ---How do you replace the fanbelt when it snaps? To the bottom of the photo - actually in front of the "ring" is the cooling water hard pipe return, and under that, is a(fixed) X-member, to which the steering rack is fixed to - that is clearly immovable. The edge closest to the pulley lies unseen almost directly under the hard pipe.

There does not appear to be any clearance to replace the fanbelt through the gap to fit round the crankshaft pulley.

Mark O

Mark,
The "sheathing / guide" that you refer to on the crank pulley is the harmonic balancer (weight) and is an integral and vital part of the pulley. Not an addition.

But your clearance for fan belt removal is certainly very tight! On mine the water pipe is slightly further forward and positioned directly central to the chassis cross brace. Maybe 6 - 8mm further forward. The other variable is the engine itself which would probably move rearwards on the slotted engine mount brackets if you slackened them a bit and used a pry-bar to shift it back a little.
Guy Weller

Guy

My thanks for that....Water pipe fixings may be unbolted and thus moved forwrad - fine, but my concern is indeed the very limited clearance between balancer and chassis cross brace. Engine mountings - yes appreciate the slots. Would I have to loosen anything else? and would it affect anything detrimentally if the engine was moved rearwards and not moved back exactly as was previously?

Of course, I may be panicking about nothing - guess the thing to do is try a spare fanbelt - with some judicious persuation.

Regards

Mark
Mark O

To move the engine back without straining anything, you may have to slacken the gearbox mountings as well. But you are really only needing a few mm of adjustment so I would imagine the exhaust has enough "give" in the rubber mountings anyway. You don't need to change the fan belt that often anyway so it's not a serious problem.
No need to panic Mr Mainwearing, don't panic, don't panic!
Guy Weller

Mark,
I had this problem when I threw a belt by over revving and over quick gear change whilst going up a hill, (I blame stray Waxoyl and not me showing off) it was mid-November so the (old) replacement belt wasn't very pliable and a pain to fit

and I've more space than you

I fitted another new belt in summer went on dead easy, I'd put it in the oven to warm it too but I'm not sure I need have now just leaving it in the hot sun might have been enough

later as I'd enquired about the engine going back further at an engine out again, clutch work again (don't ask) it couldn't but another new belt was fitted (my type of luck) to replace the previous new belt and this was strapped to the cross member so that the difficult part of getting it passed the pulley was prepared

so moral of the story fit a new belt in the summer and strap the present one to the cross member as a spare
Nigel Atkins

Nigel, I like the idea of having a spare part fitted "in waiting". Apart from anything else it is a useful place to store the spare! I would be just a little worried about it snagging on the moving belt in use. How have you got your spare one strapped to keep it secured and out of the way?
Guy Weller

Nice idea Nigel, but as Guys says, what if the spare snagged the one on the engine and stuffed them both. Ooh the irony :)
Greg H

Part of my problem of course is that the fanbelt is likely to let go at the most inconvenient of times - not lending itself to loosening engine and gerabox mounting bolts.

I suppose the real answer - if the belt cannot be persuaded through the gap - is to ensure my breakdown cover is in order.
Mark O

Mark,
if you fit a new belt every x number of years in the summer then you'll like as not be fine, I've never had a fan belt snap, I've slipped two by showing off so I don't show off and change the belt every 3 years at my convenience rather than the car's

Greg, Guy,
it wasn't my idea, the mechanic done it as the engine wouldn't move back but was out of the car at the time, it'd only be a get me home as where it is it could get oily, there's very little chance of it catching unless the plastic cable ties break and I'll trust them for a good few years yet

I've got the 'original' new belt still in the boot, when I change belts I keep the previous one as a spare, it was the first and only time I've ever had to use the spare
Nigel Atkins

Nigel, l wasn't doubting it could be secured out of the way, but was asking how it was fixed as it seems a good idea. Is it taped to the timing chain cover ?

Mark - l wasn't thinking you would start shifting the engine back on some dark wet night in an emergency. I thought you would do that now, fit a new belt and be happy knowing that if it did need doing again, the clearance was already adjusted.
Guy Weller

Nigel, l wasn't doubting it could be secured out of the way, but was asking how it was fixed as it seems a good idea.

Mark - l wasn't thinking you would start shifting the engine back on some dark wet night in an emergency. I thought you would do that now, fit a new belt and be happy knowing that if it did need doing again, the clearance was already adjusted.
Guy Weller

no it was Greg who was the prophet of doom, sorry I did put it's strapped to the cross member and later plastic cable ties that's about it - I'll try to get a photo but it's black on more black
Nigel Atkins

Guy,
sorry I realise now I've not described it well, I'll sort out the photo

but

Greg,
be warned and be prepared I've not had a chance to clean the engine bay, I don't want you getting an attack of the vapours without nearby seating
Nigel Atkins

that is close... on mine the the belt does fit,,,but it scraps the pulley and the crossmember and needs a bit of a tug to pull it thur.

the difficulties I have is wedging the belt between the pulley and the timing cover and of coarse not noticing until ive got everything bolted into place

the BIG benifit is the belt is wedge shaped... so only that outside edge at the widist part is the difficult part

prop
Prop and the Blackhole Midget

this photo will make a lot more sense than me

look at all that green, even if I brush it off I'll lose 5 points or on the score, I'll have to check with David Smith

and on the alternator fan blades you can see the rubber coating where a previous belt was slightly out of line until I added two spacer washers to the alternator fixing, I never noticed at the time but then I wouldn't

Nigel Atkins

Thanks Nigel, now I see how you mean.Not a bad idea, although I can see why you say it might get oil covered before you ever get round to needing to use it! I think I would also be concerned that it would get a bit of a "set" to it, and not then run true when straightened out onto the pulleys.

But as a get you home idea its not bad. Just not as appealing as the idea of getting an attractive female assistant to give up her tights to save the day. Or was that only ever just a fantasy?
Guy Weller

it's not as bad as I thought and it looks, what you can see is Waxoyl the engine oil is further back

I get the feeling if you took it easy it would get you home more so in the summer when the rubber would be more pliable

getting in to cut those cable ties might not be as easy as it looks too

it'd probably work well on Greg's very clean (unused) car out there in the sunny country
Nigel Atkins

I'm sure this has been posted before, but it's still good to watch.

Changing a fan belt while the engine's running...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BQhfcdQf1QA
Dave O'Neill2

I can guess what that is without looking at it

I can do it without a screwdriver just using my right foot
Nigel Atkins

That's pretty cool! But access is rather better than on a Spridget!
Guy Weller

RIP youtube keliso,

im curious ...the last time keliso did this trick.and cut his fingers off then bleed out and died on the spot

would they have superglued his fingers back on or put them in a jar for the viewing

yes children... try that at home

prop
Prop and the Blackhole Midget

Mark. I can't tell for sure from your photo but it looks like your water pipe may be the wrong way round as the end appears to be pointing forward. If this was true, the mounting brackets would be pushing the pipe nearer the crank pulley. If you take a look at my photo you can see the ends of the water pipe point to the rear of the car and the pipe itself sits much further forward than yours. Just a thought...



graeme jackson

good point graeme

I forgot those where handed

prop

Prop and the Blackhole Midget

This thread was discussed between 05/03/2013 and 06/03/2013

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