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MG Midget and Sprite Technical - Frogeye rear wing alignment

I'm trying to align the rear wings to my purchased Frogeye body shell at the moment. Why didn't someone warn me about bodywork....... Anyway I've spent many hours modifying the rear inner wings around the wheel arches where the outer wings are welded. I've had to cut, shut and hammer them etc. to achieve acceptable alignment. Bit mangled now but it'll be all hidden, filled and painted eventually.

My question is, when the outer wings are attached, should any inner wing flange be showing a little? Or should the flanges be flush with the inner edges of the outer wings, if you see what I mean?

Regard, Bill
W Bretherton

Are you looking for pictures like this?


http://www.allmetalshaping.com/showthread.php?t=7209
S

My task is simple compared to that! I admire people who can do that, but this is the first time for me and my skills are more mechanical/ electrical than fabrication. I can strip and rebuild the engine and gearbox (both done), make a wiring loom, repair an electronic tachometer, fit all the components to the car and make it go. I can spray to a reasonable standard (cellulose) but I'm struggling with what I suppose is basic bodywork to some people. I'm getting there, it just takes me a long, long time and I can see it's all about knowing what to do to make large panels fit with decent alignment. For me it's the hardest and most frustrating part of the restoration.
Bill
W Bretherton

Lots of clamps and self tapping screws Bill. Then buckets and buckets of filler! :-D

Where are you at in South Gloucestershire?

Cheers,
Malcolm
Malcolm Le Chevalier

Hi Malcolm

I do use clamps and screws and pop rivets and I'm not bad with filler! Currently, it's all about re-positioning the inner wing flanges so that the outer wings align properly. I intend plug welding the wings on so I need good flange contact all round the wheel arches presumably. I'm in Chipping Sodbury.

Bill



W Bretherton

Bill,
The rear of my frog is in a similar statecto yours. Only l am assembling the rear deck and the outer wings into a single unit, and will then fit it onto the car. This is how they were assembled in the factory. But first l did check the fit of the outer wings individually.

Like you, l had rebuilt the outer sections of the inner wing, and formed an inward pointing flanged edge to match the radius of the outer wing wheel well. I made the inner wing flange wider than needed and will simply trim off any excess with a slitting disc, to match the outer wing flange when l eventually fit the rear "clip". I am just fitting and adjusting a new rear skirt section to go below the number plate recess where the original has gone a bit frilly.
Guyw

Guy
Actually I too am going to initially weld wings to deck off the car. I'm fitting beading also and want to keep the flange part so will need to make something to bend it on. Not easy in the absence of an English wheel! But I'll have a go. My wings are a bit further apart near the front than the deck width (due to door alignment) so the beading will help.

I also have a repair panel for the lower rear but was intending to fit that after welding the rear assembly on. This will all take me some time I think....

Bill
W Bretherton

Bill,

I don't see that an English wheel would be the tool to bend the beading on, I have one and wouldn't consider it appropriate. What I would do is get a couple of pieces of steel plate thick enough to support the bead either side of the flange and cut them to slightly more curvature than you need to bend and space them apart slightly more than the bead flange width, you then need to clamp one end down with maybe a wooden conformal clamping block to avoid crushing the bead and bend away. The space between the plates will control the movement of the flange and overall the bead should be stretched slightly but it should allow for controlled bending of the section. I have this job to do in the future as when I rebuilt my frogeye the first time I had limited resources and went for a fibreglass backend at the time. The intention is to return to steel as I still have the steel centre shroud from the car.
David Billington

I rebuilt the bonnet for mine with new wings and beading. The beading is soft and bends very easly by clamping the flange in the jaws of a vice and just applying gentle pressure by hand to create the curve. I worked along from one end in small increments with regular checks on the profile against the wing. Where the curve radius is tighter l snipped notches in the flange.

It was much easier than anticipated but since then l have treated myself to a proper shrinker/stretcher device which was even easier for the rear deck beads.
Guyw

The replacement piece l made for the rear skirt also has shorter lengths of beading either side so l think l will be welding this in before fitting the whole unit. Although leaving it out as an access hole may be advantageous when welding the rear deck in. Not sure yet.
Guyw

We need more pictures on here W Bretherton...Guy!

Malcolm
Lots of clamps and self tapping screws Bill. Then buckets and buckets of filler! :-D

I haven't stopped laughing since I read that...

I was so hoping I could make the lower rear quarters of my bugeye...but I think its going to turn out just as you've stated.

I have a few friends local that have been giving me suggestions but I guess I'm going to have to just try
my luck.


S

David/ Guy

Thanks for the excellent beading suggestions. Will give it a go. I can see the flange needs holding firmly or the bead will distort sideways.

Steve

I do intend to do pictures but I'm usually typing on a tablet and my pictures are on the desktop. Suppose I ought to share its drive with the tablet.....

Bill
W Bretherton

On my car the inner wing flange wanders about a good deal, Bill. It's half a millimetre proud of the outer wing flange in one stretch, then maybe a millimetre shy in another.

I reckon that's how it came out of Abingdon.

I wouldn't be able to do it myself, in fact I can't even imagine how you stick the two flanges together, but Guy's suggestion to go wide and then cut it back sounds right.
Nick and Cherry Scoop

I will post some photos when l am back united with the car. Doing a painting job in Scotland at the moment.
Guyw

Whose car are you spraying up there, Guy?
Nick and Cherry Scoop

LOL ! House painting this time. No wheels attached. ;-)
Guyw

Multitalented Guy!

That's pretty funny...

No problem Bill...I just like pictures cuz there worth 1000 words....

Unless of coarse you're Bare butte Pokémon.

I wish Guy had one of those lapse time cameras so we could watch the vids of him in action. By the pictures he posts he is a master sheet metal craftsman!

Im learning by mangling! LOL!
S

Thanks Nick, I guessed the wing flanges would be as you describe them. I'll cut mine back, as Guy suggests, after plug welding (holes drilled in outer wing flanges welded through to inner wing flanges). The messy bits on outside of the inner wings will be well hidden.

Bill
W Bretherton

Rear skirt patch panel that I made up. Its a fairly straightforward piece to make from a flat off cut of steel. Needs a little more shaping to increase the curve at the lower edge, - this was the first trial fit.

Guyw

Bill,
This was my effort at repairing the rear near-side inner wheel arch lip. Work in progress! Similar shot to the one you posted.

The biggest problem I had was identifying exactly what the radius of the rear wheel arch was supposed to be, as the edges of both inner and outer wheel arches had mysteriously disappeared! I wasn't sure if the whole wheel arch forms part of a true circle, or if the curvature flattened a little (increasing radius) towards the rear of the wheel opening.

Guyw

Good work Guy. I didn't measure the radius but kept trial fitting the wing, tacking the inner wing edge a bit more, repeat etc. The other side needed less work and I'm now happy with both wings. Those wings have been on and off countless times! My welding is messy but will be hidden and I'll skim it with filler.

I cheated and bought a lower repair section from Frogeye Spares but yours looks good. The next job is to rebuild part of one side of the deck as some of the flange is missing plus the gap needs closing up.

W Bretherton

This thread was discussed between 25/07/2016 and 30/07/2016

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