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MG Midget and Sprite Technical - Powerlite or Edge?

I want to buy a HiTorque Starter Motor for my 948 daily driver. Will I buy Edge or Powerlite?

Flip
Flip Brühl

I fitted my (second) Powerlite starter to my 1275 in October '16 only thing that disappointed was that the rubber cover on the very thick twisted cable from starter to on board solenoid split so I had to cover it with Gorilla tape.

Easy to fit other than I had to take the dissy out.

I much prefer it to the standard starter, different sound and feel, no misses.

The thing that put me off with other hi-torque starters was the 360 degree multi-fit bracket with my luck that might have caused me issues with fitting - but I don't know for sure as I've never seen one fitted.

With the Powerlite if you want to you can do away with the remote existing solenoid thus removing another point of potential problems but of course this does mean some rewiring.

Powerlite RAC403 - http://www.powerlite-units.com/products/rac403/

Photo of the fitting instructions I got but links are also on page above.


Nigel Atkins

I fitted my second 'Edge' starter motor a few years back and it was slightly smaller and less powerful than the earlier model but works great. It's also possible with an 'Edge' starter motor to get rid of the standard solenoid (I think all pre-engaged starters have a built in solenoid) but I didn't.

Possibly there isn't much to choose between either brand so it might come down to cost or weight or appearance.
Daniel

Powerlite shows as 4kg which didn't seem that light to me, IIRC as with alternators a couple of decades back you could get, then, modern Japanese starters and alternators particularly that were a lot smaller and lighter - or did I just dream it?

Toyota gearboxes too instead of Ford too.
Nigel Atkins

Sorry just remembered, you can't remove the bulkhead solenoid when using the Powerlite RAC403 - it says so too in the instructions I posted up! I forgot.

I've got a vague feeling this information might have been missing on the fitting instructions for the previous Powerlite starter I had but as usual I can't remember and might have dreamed this.
Nigel Atkins

Flip I wonder why you want to replace your original starter. I think you rebuilt it not so long ago, or did I dream that?

If you want a perfect Lucas original inertial starter I have one here spare. You have a 948 engine - good Lord man, why d'ya need high torque? You can start it with three feet of string haha!
Greybeard

Thank you all for the information.
Good question why a Hi Torque starter:
It is a luxury problem. Yes, indeed I rebuild the starter recently. I use the Sprite as a daily driver. I drive it about 6000 km/year. I have the car for 20 Years. The previous owner drove about 200000 miles with it. I did rebuild the car 20 years ago. I drove 120000 km since without rebuild. As a young man I had to rebuild everything myself as I had no money and I had a lot of time. Later, when I had enough money, I liked it to do it myself, there was no pressure, I learned a lot. At this moment I need the car to rally. I do not have time to wait for the spares. I do not have a lot of time lat this moment. My priority is our grandson, my wive, playing golf (time consuming), the paint job of my house and working on the Lancia Fulvia with our son. I have 2 Sprite engines, 2 gearboxes, 2 generators of the sprite so I can change things and repair later.
The Lancia needed a new flywheel as the starter consumed the teeth. I am not waiting to change a flywheel of the Sprite now. I am waiting for a new better multimeter to see if it is the battery or a short in the starter-motor. The luxury of two starter-motors suits me now.

Flip
Flip Brühl

Engine earth lead?
GuyW

Fair enough Flip. Like you as a young man I had to fix it myself if I wanted to drive to work on Monday. I don't know how many weekends I spent crawling around under grungy old cars haha!
I reckon you're onto a good idea to fit a modern starter for rallying and keep the Lucas to refit for originality when you feel like it. Good call.

PS: I never drove a Fulvia but I was very fond of my Betas. A 1600 and a 2000 Volumex. Wonderful handling on dry roads but a liability in the wet!
Greybeard

Greybeard,

I loved my Beta HPE and my Delta HF turbo ie and neither had any issue in the wet whatsoever but then I had both on Avon tyres which I have always found performed well in the wet and the dry. Maybe you had the wrong tyre choice on the Beta, I know one of my mother's old Escorts had Michelins on it and they were poor in the wet but then my Austin A40 Farina had Michelins and they were absolutely fine in the wet.
David Billington

Yes it is the battery, 10.7 Volt after charging. (with the new multimeter) It is a wonder that the ignition worked well and I came home!
Tomorrow I'll buy a new battery after 8 years. I wonder if the new generator and the starter motor will work...
Earth lead is OK.

Flip
Flip Brühl

David I expect you're right about the tyres. I bought and sold both cars with whatever tyres they had at the time and have no idea what they were.
The bloke who bought my Volumex blew it up and fitted a Delta twincam engine, then wrote it off after a few weeks. A shame - I truly loved the violence of the supercharged engine.
My shortstroke 1600 still holds my personal record, North Aberdeenshire to Campbeltown - 272 miles across country in 3 hours 32 minutes the night my wife was taken into hospital for emergency surgery. Super little car, a total rev-monster.
Greybeard

Well done Flip. What's your alternator charging voltage?
Greybeard

Greybeard,

As you probably know tyres can make a significant difference to the handling, the worst Beta I drove I bought to scrap for spares and it had a different brand of tyre on each corner and the handling was diabolical, fortunately I only had to drive it from Swindon to Bath. A mate recently bought a Peugeot and he mentioned it was the only FWD car he had driven that oversteered, when I asked what the tyres were he said it had some name brand tyres on the front and an unknown Chinese pair on the back, QED I think, low grip tyres on the rear responsible for the handling trait.
David Billington

With the new battery starting is within a second (old starter motor). The ignition light did not shine... So I took a closer look at the fitting: broken see Photo* Some plumbing and the light worked. The new generator does not load the battery, the ignition light keeps on shining... at all RPM... I gues that the dead battery took to much current as the generator worked well a few days ago. What is the problem if the ignition light stays on shining?

Flip

*See my ignition light thread

Flip Brühl

Have you accidentally earthed the body of the ignition light fitting to the car body? That could make the light stay lit up. Also if it's earthed to the body there will be no excitation supply to the alternator so it will not charge.

It could also be simply that the alternator has failed.

You mentioned that you have a spare alternator I think. What about trying that one?
Greybeard

By the way the Powerlite fitting instructions that Nigel posted omitted one vital step.

»»» Disconnect the battery first «««

There could be fireworks!
Greybeard

This thread was discussed between 18/06/2018 and 20/06/2018

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