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MG ZR ZS ZT Technical - New Mini? All tits and toothpaste....

Well, today, I counted my 15th new BMiniW on the road, sad as I am.
But there is a reason behind this madness....
I have been looking hard at the type of person who is behind the wheel, and their companions (If any) and from a cusory glance it is easy to assess the demographic each person belongs to. And there are only 3..

1. Female. 20-30, Bleached blond hair, Ray-ban spex and some evidence of recent visits to a tanning salon.
Possibly a maintained/kept woman, she is sometimes partnered by another equally coiferred female, invairably chittering on a mobile.
2. Male version of above, basically.
3. The first one I ever saw was when I test drove a ZT 190. Driven by an old man in a hat.

I have yet to see one being used by a family, or, interestingly, a rich, bored housewife in Cheshire, a county where I spend the majority of my driving time. There,the Scenic 4x4 is big news.
Hmmm........
Dave

DAVE
I think you will find that most of the REAL people are waiting for the Cooper S. It will be a "Fashion car" for a while, than interest will drop big time!

MEGA

I saw a programme on the building and introduction of the new mini- one of the blokes buying it on the first day it went on sale in London had a military style T-shirt with a trendy logo, spikey hair, normally drove a Jeep but wanted a mini because it was "a little bit town"

Have to say though Dave- personally I like tits.

Hugo

MEGA, you are right. the Cooper S with the supercharger is the only model worth discussing. Still puzzled, however, by the new Chrysler/BMW Brazilian joint venture engine, which has a cast iron block, not alumimum. Very strange.
a

a,
Don't be puzzled by the fact the new engine has a cast block....it's CHEAP! Seeing as BMW decided not to use the K series or a derivative of and went on to spend so much money making a good idea suck, they had no cash to spare on the engine. Never mind, Fords still clatter along with the crossflow, they've just called it something else!
Yorkie

dave, what have been your observations of "Z"car drivers?
btw, i dont know why everyones geting so excited about the cooper s , the ZR160 is just as quick and got more space as well!
kevin neal

Oh yes, I remember something else about BMW and alloy engines.....they wear out rather quickly!
Yorkie

Dave

TITS don't u just love 'em. That reminds me - night, night!

PS. ZR160 Kev - motah's better in a Trophy!
Jerry Flint

Dave

Re "Possibly a maintained/kept woman"

Could you let me know where I can find a cheap slut who can be bought for the lowely price of a BMW 1 Series! I think I could both love her and afford her!

Cheers

Patrick
Patrick

Iam very happy that the "Trendy people" have gone for them. Let them "Debug"the MINI of faults. than lose interst in them and move on too the next "Big Thing".Other people than can get a Mini at a good price!
Mega

Yeah I saw one yesterday
Janet the wife said "woo that's the first one I've seen on the road". She wasnt very impressed! her idea of a nice car is an Aston probably as a result of her education from me about what's cool cars etc .. (really i should keep my big mouth shut!)
anyhow
Mini £10g
Aston £100g
they may be all blonde bimbo's but they cant be very wealthy ones!

N
Neil

Just a note about the engine in the mini.. it was decided on before BMW took over Rover, and the design of the new Mini had that engine in it. Do you honestly think that BMW would choose to use a Mercedes engine?

Just My,
2 pence
2 pence

Unlike anyone else here I've actually got a new MINI - Cooper red and white - and no I'm not:

1. Female. 20-30, Bleached blond hair, Ray-ban spex and some evidence of recent visits to a tanning salon.
Possibly a maintained/kept woman, she is sometimes partnered by another equally coiferred female, invairably chittering on a mobile.
2. Male version of above, basically.
3. An old man in a hat.

The Cooper is actually a very nice car to drive - I cover around 250 miles a week in it - and handles really well and is fun to drive. Maybe its not a real Mini - its far too comfortable for that - but I don't care. About the only gripe is that it lacks the power to exploit the excellent chassis, something the Cooper S will remedy (though I'm not so sure about the various add ons and tweaks the S has received styling wise. I already have mine on order ....
Andrew Jones

Well done Andrew !
I don't understand all the animosity against the new MINI. It is said to be a fine car, very pleasant to drive and of couse, it's very different to the original MINI, which is too small and spartan nowadays. They are different cars. period.
It is quite expensive compared to other cars (won't say "competitors" because it hasn't really competitors), but I suspect it will sell well and BMW will make profit. At the end of the day, that's the aim of every car manufacturer, isn't it ?
Critiscism about the new MINI I've read on these boards isn't constructive ... to say the least.
Fabrice

Fabrice,
I presume this animosity comes from the fact that:
1 - the mini was a British car and is now owned by a German manufacturer (BMW moreover!)
2 - the spirit (and the price) of the new car is really far from the original Mini.
Jérôme

The ainmosity is that unlike the real Mini this new one is just a marketing ploy. You only have to look at the lack of design flair (not to menison boot space) to see that. The first Mini broke all the rules, this one does not.

I agree that its got its good points, but its a chance that has been missed for somthing better.
Mega

Maybe the original Mini broke all the rules but BMC lost money on every one they built initially. Also Issigonis may have been an outstanding design engineer but from a production point of view his cars were something of a disaster - the water leaks on the original Mini bing a case in point.

Maybe the new MINI was a missed opprtunity - personally I think the mid engined ACV30 MGF engined concept would hace been a better bet (if somewhat impractical) as would the Spiritual - but there is no point in crying over spilt milk. There are very few radical ideas know, the Smart beign probably the last one I can think of.

Try a MINI - you might like it.
Andrew Jones

I kinda got the idea that the theme of this thread was more about doing down the owners as opposed to the car anyway?

I like tits personally, especially when large and pendulous. If they happen to belong to a bored late 30's mega-rich trophy wife who is looking to keep a slightly overweight mild pervert in the manner that he would like to be acustomed then even better.
SBD

>>...this new one is just a marketing ploy...<<
Yes, so what ??
At least, it's somewhat different.
What would you prefer ? a Rover 25, a Seat Ibiza, a VW Polo, a Clio, ..., a MINI ? Not necessary the latter, but I really can understand people who will.
The original Mini has already been invented. Now, look at Renault for inventing new concepts...
Fabrice


Just his 2Pence Spake thus.....

<<Just a note about the engine in the mini.. it was decided on before BMW took over Rover, and the design of the new Mini had that engine in it. Do you honestly think that BMW would choose to use a Mercedes engine?>>

Errr....No.
The K was always in the frame for the now 116. Superior in every aspect the the Chrysler unit - Go on, tell me I'm wrong - It is now punted along by this unit only because of an ill-concealed attempt by BMW to cosy up to DaimlerChrysler because they wanted to offload Rover.
Dave

I was a Mazed that they didn't use the K. The Iron lung was desribed by Rover insiders, was met to be a "Little Gem". It makes the lump in the Vauhall Nova look good!
Mega

The MINI engine is not half as bad as is made out, albeit a little bit asthmatic at the top end - bit like the original A Series. As for the K series I'm glad not to have an engine that is so prone to problems - HGF etc - as that thing seems to be.

The question I have to ask is this - have any of you actually driven a MINI or are you just sounding off repeating opinions you've read in magazines?
Andrew Jones

Before you formulate any constructive critisicm on a car, it is an obvious step to actually drive it.
And I did.... And there's the rub. Devoid of any character, it felt like a well-engineered German hatchback, indistinguishable, as far as I could tell, from any of the other bubble-eyed Euroboxes littering the streets. And if I wanted one, I would go down the practicality road and buy a Golf. Where, Oh Where, was the verve, the eagerness, the panache of the original? All engineered out of the window. An absolute post-modern triumph of style over substance. Sorry.
I loved it before I drove it. I dismissed the R75 as a gothic 600 replacement - until I drove it. It works both ways!
Dave

That's telling them DAVE!
Mega

Dave,

I am sorry to inform you that BMW inhereted the chrysler engine with the mini.. I remember talking to someone high up in Rover at the time of the takeover about it, who was saying that BMW didnt like the fact it had the same engine designed in it as the A-series Merc.

Just my,
2 pence

PS Though I might be wrong!
2 pence

2 pence, I am not sure to whom you spoke, but your story appears well off from the accepted history of the Mini's development.

The Mini has got a Chrysler engine- built at a BMW-Chrysler joint venture plant in Brazil IIRC.

This is not and was never a Rover inspired project.

If you look at the Rover originated concepts, they all had K-series motors, albeit with a cylinder lopped off.

Fact is, the engine is in the MINI by BMW's insistance. The fact that is such a low-tech motor- with lower specific out puts and heavier than other 4 cylinder cars at BMW-Rover group lead to widespread speculation that BMW was seaking a colaborative deal with the then independent Chrysler.

But after the engine deal was sealed, Daimler Mercedes sprung one of the biggest surprises that the Automotive industry had seen- they effectively bought Chrysler from under BMW's noses...

and the rest is histry as they say.
Rob Bell

I bet BMW are now deeply grateful that MB got Chrysler now....

Cheers

Patrick
Patrick

Hmm... Have we all lost the plot !!!!! This site is for 'Z' saloons.Anyway, who said the mini handled well????

I went to a autotest event a while back,and it feature the new mini versus the old.

The course consisted of slalom tests,reverse flicks, moving 180's, 360degree spins,reverse doghnuts,etc.
The course was timed and there were other contenders too,namely novas and toyotas and some westfields.

And what car won the event?

The old mini off course,with a time of 1min16secs,the new mini needed a calender with a time of 3mins 05secs.
The driver was Paul Swift,(Russ Swifts son),so he was no slouch,the problem was the new mini didnt like being slung about,everytime it was handbraked turned it stalled,when it did a reverse flick it stalled.

I have performed the same stunts in a ZS180, and did not encounter any so called stalling problems,the only problem that the ZS180 did give was an abs failure,which is the correct course of action the system should take,personally, I hope to get my ZS180 minus the airbags and abs braking system.

So BMW, MINI one faces British Mini,MINI one gets trashed then leaves.Ha HA HA.........
George Mackmurdie

i was questioning the bmw/chrysler brazilian engine (at the top of this thread) not so much to stir up a discussion in the changes in manufacturing alliances, but discover why Mini/rover/bmw would go with heavy cast iron, when aluminmum is now the state of the art. any thoughts?
a

Aluminium was state of the art in 1989. Cast iron is back in fashion, especially for forced induction engines, where block rigidity is of paramount importance.

Using modern techniques, a cast iron block can be made stronger, stiffer, cheaper, and only marginally heavier than an alloy block of equivalent specifications. To get the same block stiffness and stability out of alloy requires far more material.

just my 2c
G
Growler

This thread was discussed between 30/10/2001 and 09/11/2001

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