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MG MGB GT V8 Factory Originals Technical - Panhard rod, track bars, pinion snubbers

As I work along on the current conversion project, all the above are being considered to locate the rear & prevent axle wrap under max acelleration. Expense, weight & complexity are all concerns.

Would it be possible to combine several functions in one piece of hardware? Once upon a time, Moss Motors offered a "V" bar, which seems to make some sense. If 2 arms were attached to the frame cross member close to the jack points, then joined at the top of the rear end housing, it seems that this would stop the axle from rotation under acelleration, and would also prevent latteral movement. Something similar is used by GM on independent rears, with large tabs on each side of the top of the housing.

Any thoughts?
Jim

Jim, you can still get that A-arm from MGOC. I went with standard traction bars and a Hopkinson sway bar kit. Super, but prevents you from installing a conventional panhard rod (i.e. the British Automotive type which clips on to the front corner of the trunk). I still think a Panhard would be a good idea and I may hire a hot rod shop to custom-build one ... the only thing that's slightly difficult is figuring out how to attach it to the car.
Ted

I am toying with a couple ideas as well. Belwo is my brain rambling on...

Something I realised is that a stock MGB sway bar acts like a traction bar to a good extent. Look at the mounting and set-up of one. I think BL did thier homework and engineered a great thing here.. The straingt part of the bar routes over the axle then 2 arms go forward to mount to the chassis. This location make the bar itself act like a anti tramp bar. The weak part is the mount on the axle, not the welded part, but the thin metal strap holding the rubber bushing. I am thinking if a poly bushing it used and a much thicker strap is used It could act as a traction control device. Better yet a clamshell set solid Alum blocks.

Another idea is to combine both a lowering block and traction bar in one unit. Use a long 2"w x 1" tall bar to lower the rear of the car and have the long end go out forward and connect somehow to the front leaf eyelet or use a snubber type rubber unit to have it come up and hit the leaf during hard starts.
Larry Embrey

Something I have been wondering about recently is what I saw in an older Alfa. They also have a live axle, but on coil springs. Two arms run forward and locate the axle. Prevents tramp and together with a T like piece it seems that the whole assembly also works like a Panhard rod. Any comments on this?
Or isn't there enough space/clearance to fit coils?

Frank
Frank de Groot

What about a "watts linkage" system? any ideas on this?
Ive also seen on the MG Owners club page UK they have a 5 link system they used..
steve berno

Jim,

Tim Fenna at Frontline should be selling, by now, his rear traction control link.

Paul
Paul

Larry,
I've looked at that too. Then I realized I didn't need the swaybar. Plus the bar ends are made to allow fore/aft movement. Not exactly what you want in a traction device. Maybe different ends and cut the center out of the bar... might as well start from scratch, my car is a CB and doesn't have the mounts on the body. I could use the traction device and side/side locating device, but do not want to otherwise impede the movement of the axle in any way.
Jim Blackwood

Jim,
In a real traction device there is some play. There has to be some movement or the entire system would bind. Look at the traditional "slapper" bars and even the latest and greatest Slide a link system, they all have a preload or gap adjustment to allow movement.

My rear bar is now out, we will see how traction is once I get my A/F guage installed and the header back on.
Larry Embrey

Yes but here you're talking about a suspension that to a very large degree mimics a four link, with the front half of the leafs making the bottom link and the swaybar making the top link. Any fore/aft play in either link translates to axle wrap and wheel hop. As long as the top link attachment points are located properly, axle housing rotation with suspension movement will be minimal, and with suitable ends suspension movement will not be limited in undesired ways. Slapper bars have to allow relative movement because it is mounted right on the spring and the spring flexes. Admittedly this system is not going to be as stiff as a true four link for the same reason, but it's a lot simpler, and gives a lot more control than the stock leaf spring geometry. Using the stock swaybar as is probably helps some on the RB cars, but it's not designed for traction control. For that, good stiff omnidirectional elastomer bushings at both ends should work fairly well.
Jim Blackwood

Yeah I am thinking of replacing the stock axle mounts for the sway bar with solid alum blocks. I removed the sway bar last week to try and stop the oversteer (no front sway bar installed). While doing so I noticed that I have bent onf of the stock mounts, so it is working to some extent. Now without the sway bar she squats bad and gets more out of sorts under had acceleration..


Larry Embrey

Guys, I don't know much about this subject and jargon and haven't even seen an MG rear antiswaybar so bear with me if I state the obvious or make some gaff. I like the sound of that "A bar" if its what I suspect it is.
Have I got this straight?
It should have a "pivioting point/bush" attached near the spring (U bolts?)on the axil, go forward and inward to an axis line between the spring hangers, attach to a strong bush, then go across to the other side of the car (along the hanger(s) axis), bush again, then back and out to the other axil piviot point. Not so much an A as an U shape /_/ (down is forward). The forward component would act as an antitramp bar (like the RV8) and the inward component would prevent sideways movement (a kind of short panhard rod?)and haveing one continous bar would act as an antisway.
Peter

That first slash should be a back slash
Peter

/_/
like

There'd be any number of ways of doing it, but the problem is finding a way to combine functions in a complimentary way in order to decrease the number of devices. For instance, moving the swaybar under the springs and making it more of a "V" shape can be a way of combining the panhard function while moving the roll center downwards, however it's not an effective way of controlling spring wrap. Mounting the same device high allows control of spring wrap but also moves the roll center upwards which is usually undesireable. While it might be possible to go far enough below the springs to do the trick the links would need to be stiff therefore bulky/heavy and would tend to compromise ground clearance. This helps explain the continuing popularity of multilink suspensions.
Jim Blackwood

This thread was discussed between 22/05/2002 and 05/06/2002

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