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MG MGB Technical - 2 to 3 Wiper Conversion!!

Why is it that living in a country where it rains all the time we have 2 wipers and, in the Hot and Paradise like dominion over the water gets 3.

Is there a kit to add a 3rd wiper to my B or is it not feasible.

Any help gratefully received.

David Tetlow
D M Tetlow

David,

there is no kit offered for adding a third whiper arm. The later LHD cars had this 3 whiper layout but also different gears in the whiper motor unit and different parking positions for the arms.
May be it is possible to add a whiper drive of a late LHD modell to the motor of a RHD B, but have a look upon the arms to, they are bendet just into the other direction than yours are now. I think there is a lot of modification to different parts upon your list just for a third whiper blade. Why not try Lotus effect liquid on the screen first?

BTW the whethermen promised 'summer' within some days...

Ralph
Ralph

Ralph

Thanks for the help. I think our wipers are the same direction as the USA and Europe. As most MGB's went to the USA it must have been cheaper to make them all the same!!

Looking at pictures of American and UK cars it seems the drives's side (UK) has the same position but the drivers side (USA) is different.

I can but hope.

Regards

Dave
D M Tetlow

I've got 3 wipers on mine ( ex Florida car), when I rebuilt with a Heritage shell I had to drill it to keep the wipers 'original', mine park to the right (sitting in the drivers (RHD) seat), and the hole spacing ( measured from the wing sealing strip ) is 10", 24" and 36" approx, if this helps.

You would need a US triple motor drive as well of course.
M Barnfather

Hi N Barnfather
Thanks for the info :)
How many holes were different for the UK version?
Did you have to drill all 3?
Regards
Dave
D M Tetlow

Unless you find some sort of small annoying spot in your field of vision - don't bother.

The requirement for the third wiper for the MGB and others (like the E-type) is based on a regulated percentage of windshield (windscreen) swept by the wipers. That makes sense on the surface (pardon the pun), but in practice, the middle wiper only incrementally wipes a small triangle of the screen that's already obscured for the driver by the rear view mirror. The other two wipers handle the rest of the screen without difficulty. The configuration meets the regulation, but does not do the driver any good at all.

(As a general practice, the regulation makes sense, but when you have a wide and low windscreen such as the one on the B or E-type, you get these sorts of conditions. For all I know, it might even be of value on the Jag - but not so much on the MG.)
John Z

Thanks John
I have been having problems with my wipers.
They failed on the MOT (yearly test) due to insufficient coverage. I had fitted new arms and blades from the MGOC. I had to fit the old arms to pass the test.
The coverage is poor but to be honest I think the 3 wipers look real coooool and if it was not too much hassle I would like to fit them :)
Dave
D M Tetlow

Dave,

John Z has allready expained the reason for the 3 whiper layout and i have compared my GT (2) and the Roadster (3) and can only agree. Of course i can undertand you very well and it was one of the reasons this car came upon my list in the 1970's.
If you want to do this conversion, try to find a complete whiper mechanism from a LHD car with motor and gearbox atatched and the whiper arms too.
I think you will have to mesure out the different positions of the holes for the whiper arms very exactly and drill and file out to the right dimension. Then it should be a simple swap.

Ralph
Ralph

My car is an old US car too and has three wipers. I agree with David, it just looks cool! My wipers aren't fitted and neither is the windscreen so if you need any measurements I can get the easily off my body shell if you like.

Simon
Simon Jansen

David. John Z is correct. There was a US government mandated requirement that a certain amount of the windshield/windscreen be covered by the wipers. This brought about the three wiper system on the North American (US and Canada--the Canadians got stuck with what we required) vehicles.

Whether this is a "good thing", or not, only the driver can decide.

Some questions come up. I am not an expert on wiper systems, nor do I have a torn down car to examine. Hence, Simon, with his ex-US car might be able to provide some insight.

First would be, do the wiper bosses/activating mechanisms, require any form of reinforcement under the area in front of the windscreen? If so, a reinforcement piece would have to be added. If not, it would simply require that one drill a hole and attach the third boss.

Second would be does this system require a different wiper arm than the two wiper system, or, a different blade?

It would seem to me that the difference between motors is a non-player. I would believe that the motors were basically the same regardless of number of wipers. Where the motors "parked" and the design of the inner and outer cable sheath would be different between the two.

There was a tech article in MGB Driver, the journal of the North American MGB Association, on how to make the wipers park on the opposite side of what is standard, in the US. This might indicate (I have not read the article recently) that all you need to cause the wipers to part "on the other side" is a small fitting. One which might be contained in your current wiper motor (which might, also, be suitable for use with a three wiper system with the suitable cables).

Should you wish to discuss this, please contact me through my website, www.custompistols.com/ where there is a direct link to a much better e-mail server than the one I list here. (Mostly used as a "spam trap".)Make sure you note that it is an MG related question, or it will go into the "spam trap" and be deleted. I can, probably, get you the parts you need within my monthly "gift" budget. Thus, no money required from you, only a posting on what was required to do the job, how well it worked, and whether it would be a worthwhile modification for others to consider.

Les
Les Bengtson

Dave

If your wipers are working as designed I don’t see how they can fail the MOT unless all MGBs with that setup are also failing. In what way do your wipers not provide sufficient coverage. If the old arms are longer than the MGOC replacements then there apparently is a problem with the replacements. Are you using the correct blade length? Can you use a 1" longer blade? Are the wheel boxes worn so that you are getting only partial travel? It may be that replacement of the wheel boxes and activating “cable” is all that is required. There is also a thread somewhere in the archives that talks about “turning the wheel boxes over” to operate them on a non-worn segment of the mechanism.

HTH

Larry
72BGT
Larry Hallanger

Dave,.

You will have to compare measurements...I honestly can't remember if we had to blank one or two of the 'old' holes.

My measurements are taken from the right hand (drivers side)joint strip, there was no additional reinforcements, the cable drive is supported by the 3 chrome escutcheons which hold the wheel boxes in place .

Wiper arms and blades are standard MGB, so you can use existing ones.


Mike
M Barnfather

To answer Les' question, there are no reinforcements under the scuttle for the wiper wheel boxes.

The wheel boxes are the same for the 2 and the 3 wiper systems, you just need one more along with its spacer, gasket, chrome plinth, nut and wiper arm. There is a difference between the roadster and GT versions of the wheelbox and spacer so make sure you stick with the correct ones!

The wiper motor/gearbox can be made to park on the opposite side quite easily. There is a plastic "cam" that needs to be repositioned 180* from it's original position on the gearbox output gear wheel.

The drive cable will be the same, so no change needed there. The spacer tube (soft alloy) in the middle will need to be swaped out for 2 intermediate ones used on the 3 wiper system. If you have a tubing cutter and a flaring tool it is easy enough to modify what you have to make what you need.

To add to what Larry posted - Now is the time to 'renew' your wiper mechanism to be like new. Before disassembly mark the area of the wheelbox gears engaging the push-pull cable. Mark which side of the cable engages the wheelbox gears. Rotate the wheelboxes so they engage the cable on an unused portion of the gear teeth. Flip the cable over so it is also working on an unused portion. Of course clean out the old grease (wax/soap by now!) and regrease.

Good luck,
Tom
Tom Sotomayor

I suppose it's all a matter of you always want what you can't have, isn't it? Here in the States, most people feel that the third wiper is an unwelcomed and cluttering intrusion on the otherwise clean lines of the car - like we feel about sidemarker lamps and (ultimately) rubber bumpers. I guess in the UK it's so unusual it's cool.

I wonder what the original design team would have thought of this phenomenon?

PS - I have to tip my hat to the MG engineers, as they centered the twin posts on my GT, permitting "handing" the wiper blades for LHD and RHD versions while meeting the reg's. Not as easy as it seems - look at subsequent designs. Originally, I felt sure that RHD and LHD cowls and post positions would have had of been unique - but they aren't.
John Z

Now, I Like 3 wipers, only the Morgan and E type have them..so we're in good company.

M Barnfather

Dear M Barnfather,

my be you can help me with a tip upon where to order the chrome surounding for the head lamp cowls as on the image of your B.
I am after them for nearly 30 years now and learned that they were made by an Australian tuner, although
there is an information given in 'The Magic Of MG' that they were distributed by BMC, but they are not shown in the original Leyland spare parts cataloge, nore in the competition section.

Is there any source wher i could get these items today?
Would be great to have any information!

Ralph

Ralph

Ralph,

I'm afraid I cheated...the cowls are held on by small round magnets glued into holes in the plastic cowls, and the 'chrome surrounds' are actually sticky back chrome plastic sheet, cut to shape.


Mike
M Barnfather

Mike,

thank you for the fast reply to my question.
The cowels I have since many years are not that straight that i can imagine to fix them with magnets.
The item that was produced by Peter Manton Motors from Melbourne is showen in the Brooklands Book MGB Gold Portfolio on Page 92 and The Magic Of MG by Mike Allison showes the same pic. on page 175 in the 1978 issue.
I am wondering why none of the part dealers did ever try to offer this stuff. I would by two sets of this immediately!
May be some enthusiasts from Down Under can help both of us with more details?
Anyway, thank you very much.

Ralph
Ralph

Ralph,

I had to warm the covers over the gas hob to get them to match exactly the shape of the wings, in order to get the magnets to sit flat on the metal.

I used 6 magnets per side, modern disc magnets are very strong, and hold the covers on very well.

As an aside , they cut down wind noise by a surprising amount, I presume that the aerodynamics are improved...MOT tests show no difference to beam pattern...clearly the MG engineers who designed the Sebring covers knew what they were doing.
M Barnfather

Ralph

One reason is that they are illegal in most, if not all, of the US. Doesn't mattter that they do not affect the beam pattern. Without this market the financial picture is not a favorable.

FWIW

Larry
Larry Hallanger

Larry,

thank you for this information that i did not know, nore really understand with all that custom parts sold for the US made cars...

I am wondering whether Alfa Spiders (not the Duetto) or Nissan Z 240 - 300 were also sold without this covers in the USA although they all were fitted to these modells sold in Europe.

Ralph
Ralph

Dave - if your wipers failed the MOT through lack of coverage you must have the wrong combination of arm and blade, thousands of cars get through the MOT every year (or at least don't fail on wipers). There were several different lengths over the years, and the position of the spindles in the panel at the base of the screen varied as well to complicate things still further. The fact it passed with the old arms proves the point.

Paul Hunt 2

This thread was discussed between 30/07/2007 and 02/08/2007

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