MG-Cars.info

Welcome to our Site for MG, Triumph and Austin-Healey Car Information.

Parts

MG parts spares and accessories are available for MG T Series (TA, MG TB, MG TC, MG TD, MG TF), Magnette, MGA, Twin cam, MGB, MGBGT, MGC, MGC GT, MG Midget, Sprite and other MG models from British car spares company LBCarCo.

MG TD TF 1500 - Door sheet metal at hinge and corner

The interior sheet metal has separated from the exterior sheet metal at the bottom corner of the left door on my TF.
> Should I fix it? How? What happens if I leave it as is?

You can also see in the photo that the exterior sheet metal extends beyond the pocket for the hinge. The pin-side of the hinge rests on the exterior sheet metal instead of on the bottom of the pocket.

The trial fit of the door to the quarter panels with new hinge pillar and latch pillar is near perfect, so I feel that I should add shims under the hinge so that it stays at the same level but makes total contact with the pocket.
> Do you agree?

I haven't stripped paint from the car yet, so I can make repairs as needed.

Bruce - before you reply ... I just can't push myself into removing the skin from the door to inspect and possibly repair the wood. It looks good to my untrained eye.

Thanks for your help,

Lonnie
TF7211


LM Cook

Lonnie. You must have had the same panel beater after an extended lunch at the pub! I had the same problem with my doors. If you’ve been following my door issues in the other forum you‘’ll see what I ended up doing. Yes I would fix it but you might be opening up a can of worms as you disassemble the door to make repairs. You might consider replacing the timbers as I imagine they won’t be looking so good. If this is a door to be painted then this is a no brainer to make the door/s solid.

If you do decide to tear the door apart take a black marker pen and scribe a witness line along all the inner structure where the door crimps. This will do two things.
W A Chasser

Hi Lonnie, The door has functioned perfectly since 1954 or so. I would leave it alone to avoid opening up a big can of worms. A couple thin shims would be fine and would fix that problem. If you filed the overlap to match the base of the pocket, that would alter the angle of the door and would mess up the alignment. I have a couple of shims on my car, you can't see them at all. Looks like the small metal piece was too small when the door was made. George
George Butz III

Thanks Bill,

(I followed your door saga, but didn't check it before I posted. Forgot whether it was by you or Bruce and addressed my last sentence to him instead of to you.)

I'll remove the door strengthener today, see what's underneath, and report back.

Thanks for any advice that you can give to me.

Lonnie
TF7211
LM Cook

Lonnie
I do not recognise that black strip. Can you supply a complete photo of exactly what it does?
Sandy
Sanders

Sandy -

That’s the door stiffener inside the hinge side of the door. Possibly purchased new and black by previous owner (Jeanie) after she had the car painted. The one on the other door was painted red with the rest of the car. The part is no longer available on Moss site.

I’ll know more when I remove and look under it. Fingers crossed.

Lonnie
TF7211
LM Cook

The black piece is an original part. It would have been black originally. Lonnie By driving a 6” wide putty knife behind the flange and crimp it will spread the crimp so you can easily move the inner door structures inward and away from the door skin with out stressing the fold. But before you make the attempt to remove anything take a marker to show their position. If you need any assistance PM me at the other site and I will give you my phone # if you don’t already have it.

When you pull all the brads and screws out of the timbers you will need that putty knife to spread the sheetmetal in order to lift the hinge timber out first. Then the top timber, followed by the latch timber and then the bottom. Reassembly is in the reverse order.

If the timbers are relatively solid I would suggest treatment with QuikPoly it similar product to ensure their integrity or by new timbers all together. My preference would be Craig Seabrook as his have required less fiddling.

Look forward to hearing from you should the need arise.

Regards

Bill Chasser
TD-4834
W A Chasser

Woo Hoo ... no rot

Photos are in subsequent posts on this thread.

OBSERVATION:
I removed the door strengthener from my left door. No rot underneath. In fact, it may be relatively new wood. The strengthener may have been replaced at the same time. The inside of the strengthener is screwed to the wood in the usual places. The lip wasn't nailed. No nail holes in the wood from the previous strengthener.

Assuming that the sheet metal was pulled back to replace the wood - - I'm really impressed with the quality of the metal work. Looks factory-new.

TWEAK:
Against George's advice, I inserted three credit cards under the hinge pocket between the sheet metal and the wood. That almost allowed the hinge to stop touching the outer sheet metal. A fourth credit card will do the trick.

RESULTS:
The credit card shims pushed the inner sheet metal away from the wood inside the door and made it almost flush with the outer sheet metal. As a result, the inner sheet metal returned to its proper position under the lip of the outer sheet metal.

But now there's a gap between the corner of the wood and the inner sheet metal at the bottom corner of the door. The sheet metal does not flex or move at the gap. I can insert some wood shims; bend the inside toward the wood and nail it; or leave it as is.

I hung the door on the car with new hinge pillar and quarter panels in place. Even though the inside bottom rear corner of the door is now moved back, it still doesn't contact the corner of the quarter panel.

The fit against the quarter panels is still near perfect.

MY PLAN (for now)
1) Insert a fourth credit card shim behind the hinge pocket.
2) Replace the credit cards with brass or steel shim
3) Add 0.016" brass shims between selected areas of the hinge leaves and the pockets on the door and between the hinge leaves and the pockets on the quarter panel to make the pins coplanar. Won't take much.

Still need to do a lot more work before I hang the doors for good.

Pics to follow.

Lonnie
TF7211
LM Cook

Door strengthener:
The black U-shaped piece behind the hinges is the door strengthener. Moss part #Moss #449-045 (not available). Illustration #51
https://mossmotors.com/tf-body-panels

Yes, that's red paint over undercoating plus remnants of carpet padding on the inside of the door.

Lonnie
TF7211

LM Cook

Areas of concern on original photo in this thread,

Yellow Circle: Inner door pocket is below the edge of the outer door skin

Blue Circle: Inner door sheet metal separated from the outer door skin.

Lonnie
TF7211



LM Cook

Effect of credit card shims

You can see the white tops of two of three pieces of credit cards between the hinge pocket and the door wood. They are NOT between the hinge and the hinge pocket. Also note that the inner sheet metal has moved back under the crimped lip of the door skin.

Chris Couper suggested seam sealer where the two panels have come back together.

Lonnie
TF7211

LM Cook

Gap between door wood and the inner sheet metal.

The credit card shims moved the inner sheet metal away from the bottom corner of the door wood. It doesn't interfere with the door opening at the rear quarter panel. May bend it a little and nail. Don't want to seal and trap water.

The wood is solid. The gap at the corner is about 1/4 inch. The rest of the door fits tightly against the wood.

Lonnie
TF7211

LM Cook

"Chris Couper suggested seam sealer where the two panels have come back together."

Actually I was talking about putting the sealer under the sheet metal before it slipped under the crimp thinking it might not make it that far. Probably not necessary now.

If you put the sealer into the gap make sure you have the two holes on the bottom sheet metal that allow the door to drain water out. I can't see those on your pictures.
Christopher Couper

Thanks Chris - I understood that you meant to put seam sealer where the inner sheet metal slipped under the crimp of the outer sheet metal. A nail though the lip of the inner sheet metal into the wood after I attach the hinges should hold it in place. The drain holes are in the door and they are open.

I'm not real concerned about the big gap. The metal does not flex at all. Water may get in, but it has plenty of space to evaporate out. I may drill a drain hole at the lowest point.

Lonnie
TF7211
LM Cook

Not really a separation for the blue circle. That piece is meant to come out so the wood can be put in the door. That is why there is a cut in the metal there.
Bruce Cunha

This thread was discussed between 02/11/2019 and 03/11/2019

MG TD TF 1500 index

This thread is from the archives. Join the live MG TD TF 1500 BBS now