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MG TD TF 1500 - HMV 100 radio installation MGTD

Last year I started a thread regarding HMV radios. This is a continuation of that thread. I purchased several Restored HMV 100 radios for my use and at that time I could source various HMV models for differing markets that were period correct for TCs-TFs if any one is interested please contact me via a PM. I won’t answer inquiries on the forums.

For the purpose of this thread and for those who have factory or dealer installations in a TD, I need your help. I need detailed pics of how the radio is mounted in the glove box.

Td/c-8151 and Td/c 16920 both had radios at one time but the supporting hardware was not present. What is used to support the HMV 100 radio? I know that the small angle iron pieces attached to the subdash on either side of the glove box door are used. But what do the brackets look like and dimensions and how do the brackets attach to the radio and and the subdash. I can detach the amplifier from the radio and mount it to the back of the tool box if necessary to remove some weight from the unit. Smith HMV brochures show an illustration of such an installation For the Mdl 4100/4102 but the other details are not shown. This type of installation I don’t believe is relevant for the Mdl 100. Obviously the cardboard box alone cannot support the radio due to the radio’s weight .

Regarding the glove box itself. I have original boxes that have perforations to allow holes to be knocked out for antenna and power cords and some sort of side mount but if the boxes are actually used intact it would seem that the radio could overheat when in use because there would not be air circulation.

I also need a template for the front fascia panel and to know what material was used and how it was secured to the box and radio.

Any detailed pics in situ or out of the dash would be greatly appreciated. I hope to have these details ready when the car returns from paint.

The HMV 100 has an integrated speaker within the main body and also can accept an external speaker. The original under dash panels also had perforations to knockout a hole for the external speaker. I do have that speaker and grill yet to be restored.

Anything that can be provided would be most helpful in my installation


Bill Chasser
TD-4834
TD/c-8151
TD/c-16920
TD-19408
TD-24060


W A Chasser

Bill, I know you want it to be authentic, but, in reality, who cares? Do you want authentic or want music?
Just go on line or Walmart and buy a Bluetooth receiver/speaker box. Then load Pandora or Spotify or Amazon music app on your cell phone or download music files directly to the phone and play any one of over 1 billion songs for free! Some also support am/fm stations which of course are always free. And if you get a cell call whilst driving you can talk hands free over the bluetooth speaker as well! Welcome to the 21st century!

Just my humble opinion,
Ed
efh Haskell

Image 1

https://www.mg-cars.org.uk/mgtd/mgtd_radiomobile_manuals.htm
Christopher Couper

Ed I want authenticity. I have a wireless Bluetooth adapter to have classic tunes piped through the vintage radio. The car is a high end little expense spared restoration and except for several personal yet period add ons like the engine turned dash and sill plates the plan is a show quality car when completed

Thanks Chris. I have the complete pamphlet but it doesn’t show the details requested to complete the installation.

Bill Chasser
TD/c-8151
W A Chasser

Bill,



I am not able to answer all of your questions but can shed some light on the issues.

You seem to under the impression that the installation of the 100 model is similar to the 4100/4200 models, in fact it is not.

Here is what you need to do.

1/ Remove the cardboard glove box, this is not needed.

2/ Remove the two brackets that are screwed behind the dash, (if you have them) they are not needed.

3/ Make a wooden spacer to go behind the glove box hole, this is to ensure that the radio does not interfere with the closing of the glove box door.

4/ Split the "power unit" from the radio, this is the part which you call the "amplifier".

5/ Fit the power unit to the back of the toolbox, this is almost identical to the installation of the 4100/4200 units. Make sure the it is offset from the radio.

6/ You need to make 4 metal fixing brackets, 2 which go from the spacer( step 3) to the front of the set, 2 which go from the upper rear of the dash, across the top of the set (above the fixing holes on each side of the set) and then to upper wooden strips of the tub.

In my case I didn't split the two units, this was a mistake as it was a very tight fit from front to back.

You don't need an external speaker, there is no provision for one, the integrated one is sufficient.

Hope this helps.



John
J Scragg

Bill: If you want to share the rest of the pages with the community I will be glad to post them. I only had the two of the installation manual.
Christopher Couper

John thank you for your response.

I have both HMV100 and HMV 4102 radios and I am aware of the physical design differences. This is why the 4100 installation illustrations are not particularly useful in the Smiths Installation pamphlet I have available. I have not seen any earlier versions of the pamphlet that illustrate or describe the installation in T Series cars with the HMV100. I’m sure the pamphlet exists but have never come across one in my searches.

The HMV100’s only attachment points that I can see is a 90° bent rail formed into the sides of the main bodies top edge. This has reinforcement overlay that is part of the top cover for the main body. In the rails are four slotted holes that are approximately 5/8” long in each rail to move the radio for and aft ~1/4” when the mounting bolts are in place. I would assume the rails to be where the fixing brackets you described as mounting to the back of the sub dash and firewall timber would locate onto the radio. Would this have been similar or identical to the factory brackets to support the top of the subdash under the center of each of the scuttle bulges? Is this an installation that you currently have? Any chance you are able to take pictures?

Is it possible the L brackets on the back of the sub dash on either side of the glove box opening where used to support the spacer/front fascia in the glove box opening. I thought that in previous threads the common assumption was the L brackets were in place to support the radio installations

If you have pics of an installation it would be helpful to me.
W A Chasser

Chris I thought I sent them to you last summer. Let me know which pamphlet you have and what pages you need. And I’ll send them to you once I get the car back from paint. You can’t imagine how packed my rooms are with boxes of parts at the moment in support of three projects. I can’t put my hands on the pamphlet at this time but I may have scanned and stored them onto my computer when I received it with the radios.
W A Chasser

Bill, first let me say that you have been very helpful to me in the past. Thank you. But I find your statement, "I won’t answer inquiries on the forums" To be at odds with the purpose and function of the Forum. I, and I'm sure you, have received valuable knowledge from posts and responses made here. Asking for information here but refusing to answer questions here seems rather self serving and in conflict with what public forums are all about. I'm sure many people are interested in the discussion of early T Series radios even if they aren't currently in possession of one themselves. I know I am. Again, asking for information in the Forum but refusing to answer questions here is not in line with your frequent and informative activity here. I'm surprised.

Tim
Timothy Burchfield

Bill,

I have never been able to find any document on the installation of the 100 model for a TD. Attached is a drawing showing the unit in some other car. It shows the fixing brackets. The main difference is that this radio is fitted is under the dash.

J Scragg

Bill: I only have what is shown on the link above. Only two pages of the installation manual but John provided me the entire service manual.

If you look real careful at the first image of the installation manual you can see the three brackets that mount the radio.

The first are in you car already and are those L brackets that are mounted on the back of the sub dash.

The other two (A & B in the image) are a bit harder to discern but I suspect if you have a better image you can make them out easier.
Christopher Couper

Hi Chris. Again thank you. I have the image you refer to that shows a RHD T type illustration. (Shown below for clarification from The Original MGTD website). The issue is that it shows a HMV 4100 installation. The HMV 4100 is an entirely different design from the HMV 100 that was available when my car was built. The HMV 4100 was a later mdl that came out circa 1952 from what I was able to ascertain from my scant internet research. i say scant because their doesn’t seem to be a great deal of information out there that I could find. Certainly not for the lack of effort. The HMV 4100 has entirely different attachment points. As you can see in that illustration the glove box appears to be still attached to the sub dash and the radio sits inside. This is mentioned in my first post in paragraph three. The 4100 also uses a remote speaker which would be affixed to the center of the under dash panel directly over the trans tunnel. However, The speaker is integral to the HMV 100 which is encased in the lower part of the main body of the tuner. I will try to drag out both radios and place them side by side and take a pic for comparison and add it to this discussion later.

I’m am leaning towards John Scraggs’ description that the glove box is completely deleted from the dash for several reasons. First the Mdl HMV 100 is physically larger than the HMV 4100 which would likely mean the box must be deleted. Second, the perforated knockout holes in my original glove boxes (unknown date of manufacture) do not support a HMV 100 installation. Third, if the glove box was to be included with HMV 100 installation, the speaker volume output would muffled severely from not only being encase within the glove box but also to an extent from the under dash panel as well.

It may be interesting to note that I have several under dash panels that I have acquired. Both have knockout perforations to support the external speaker needed for a HMV 4100 installation. I cannot say if pre 1952 cars would have these perforations or not as I don’t have any original remnants of panels from from TD-4834 or TD/c-8151 to look at.

Bill Chasser
TD/c-8151


W A Chasser

Bill,

Your last input is a very clear description of the situation. For the sake of completeness, I have this to add.
The model 100 was on the market from 1948 to 1951 and was replaced in 1951 by model 4100. In that case, for the purist, if the car is around 1952 or later then the correct model is the 4100, if not then the model 100 should be used.


John



J Scragg

John thank you for saying it succinctly. When trying to explain details where many may not realize and cannot see there are differences firsthand, it can be imost difficult to try and get an idea across.

I’m still hoping that someone may come forward with original installation pics in their TDs. And a template for the spacer(?) and front fascia panel.

Bill Chasser
TD/c-8151
W A Chasser

OK. Thanks for education of the particular model years.

Just finding anyone with a original radio in a TD besides Bill and John could be an interesting challenge.

I updated the Radio page with Johns comments about models and years.
Christopher Couper

While I love the authenticity, I went the opposite direction. I built speakers into my headrests (on my rollbars completed a long time ago), a subwoofer into the back floor, and ran it all through bluetooth from my phone. So music is freely available but invisible...
Geoffrey M Baker

This thread was discussed between 18/11/2019 and 23/11/2019

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