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MG TD TF 1500 - New Moss Side Panel Issues

At the time I bought these, aprox 2 1/2 years ago, the car was in pieces, so the;ve been in the shipping box ever since. Just took them out for fitting and discovered they are too long! 3/16th of an inch to long in the rear and 3/4 of an inch in the front. Some bolt holes are off and some completely missing. There are other issues, but I won't go into them. Even though I've had these for quite a while still in the original box, I'm going to call Grant at Moss and see what they want to do about them. I could modify them with not too much trouble, but for what I paid for them, I shouldn't have to do that. Here's a couple shots. PJ

Paul S Jennings

Another,



Paul S Jennings

They are much larger than the originals in some areas, more than just length! This little step is 3/16th of an inch too low and won't set on top of the chassis. PJ

Paul S Jennings

I'm just glad I didn't put the new grill on before I started this maneuver! PJ
Paul S Jennings

How is the alignment for the bonnet latches?
Frank Cronin

Didn't check them yet Frank. If I have to modify them, I'll use the original panels as a pattern, as the one thing wrong with them is they were cut out at the shock position to except MGA shocks. These panels are even too tall in the front by one inch! They lay on the chassis before the holes will even come close. So the bottom front will have to be cut off by one inch! I have no idea who made these panels, but they must have been blind! PJ
Paul S Jennings

Seems like much of the new stuff is very off in size. I just ordered a new wooden front rail for the convertible top and am POSITIVE it won't fit :). Even the local guy looked at me and said "You do know these never fit properly?".
I don't know why that is, I don't believe Abingdon had that much "slop" originally...
I think its the problem that we have moved from doing these on an assembly line (in Abingdon) with precise jigs to farming them out to one-piece-at-a-time machine shops in India or China...
The Brits weren't very precise, but they were a LOT better than what we are doing now for replacement parts...
Geoffrey M Baker

Glen Adams is the CEO of the Moss Western Division & is in a position to correct these issues. He just needs to be made aware of them. Cheers
Peter TD 5801
P Hehir

Putting aside the hole question, I was once told that each bonnet (and side panel, at least on TA-TD), was fitted on the assembly line by a worker with tin snips, since every one varies somewhat.

All the ones I have examined closely look very nicely finished, and I've never seen that particular step on any of the old Pathe films. Old wives' tale?

Tom Lange
MGT Repair
t lange

I should be able to clear this up.

I have NOS bonnet tops and side panels in oxide primer complete with from memory yellow crayon part numbers. I have a customer who has one NOS side in mat black with yellow crayon also longer as I will describe.

All NOS panels have front and rear edges 3/4" too long as they require trimming to fit the grille and the firewall.

This is how they were done in the factory as has been already suggested by Tom with large Gillbow tin snips.

The genuine survivors if still in original paint do show this trimmed edge especially the firewall end as a small curve not straight.

I always renew these panels on most restorations as they are usually bent and battered and as we carefully align the body tub to the chassis they mostly do not fit the gaps, Also as one adjusts the rebuilt body and packers to get the body tub aligned with the doors fitting again, these original panels never fit perfectly again.

The factory had a casual approach during assembly,so no two bonnet sides and tops are exactly the same from car to car.

The bottom fold always has to be adjusted also.

The Moss panels should be too long also for individual fitting so you should not complain about this.
Rod Brayshaw

Thanks fellas, but for what I, (anyone), pay for these panels, there should be some indication that they have to be trimmed and fitted! There is none anywhere I've seen. If I had been aware of this, I would have redone my old panels, they fit perfect and I could have saved 700+ bucks to boot! There is no logical reason that the little step on the bottom should have to be cut off, raised up and welded in the proper position. The panel is too tall in the front and has to be cut down by removing at least 1 inch of material from the bottom, it has a rolled edge!
Say what you will, but 400 bucks for this piece of tin that has to be chopped up to fit is ridicules! (Not happy).JMHO. PJ
Paul S Jennings

I'm pretty sure there was a comment in the Moss paper catalog that some degree of hand fitting would be required with sheet metal, not sure if still there or not. Quite easy to shorten, and as said above trimmed to perfect alignment. Same with moving the L shaped part, for a sheet metal or old school body shop. Even today aftermarket mass produced body panels have a somewhat casual fit, so not a surprise. Back in the day, the only replacement body panels available were fiberglass, so we are lucky today. Maybe put one set on ebay? George
George Butz

There was an earlier thread on this same topic. I bought a "carburettor side of the car" panel for my TF from KIlmartin sheet metal in Australia. They do supply to Moss but the units Paul has bought are not from them as their panels are finished in black primer and have a Kilmartin label on them.
Their panels also need to be trimmed to length and have the wing and side panel holes drilled. The height is correct and so is the position of the bonnet catch holes. I would recommend all of their replacement panels to anyone.
Max Irvine

Max, I bought a couple Kilmartin MGB panels back in 2004 or 2005, not sure and yes they were primed in black! Funny thing about them is, they bolted right on out of the box with no adjustments! Problem we have today is, all of this stuff is farmed out to the lowest bidder and you know what that means! Quality isn't there any more unless were lucky enough to get a local company who cares about their product! Not many of them left anymore. PJ
Paul S Jennings

I feel your pain Paul...but perhaps not to the same degree. Numerous parts going on this TC are not "plug and play". Sometimes ..yes it's the lowest vendor price, but more often than not it's a case of getting anyone to manufacture the parts at all...without cost consideration. And yes...at the price for some of the parts it pisses me off...big time occasionally.

Here is a small one...replacement screws for the brake drums. over length....work fine on the front drums but because of the extra length they bottom out on the rear hub before securing the drum. There is no other application shown in the Moss data base for these, so why not make them correctly.

I had to modify new brake shoes on the rear to make them work.

New urethane bushings that have to be cut down to fit but no instructions of how to do so.

Carb kit pieces don't fit or aren't finished.

Got some new acorn bolts for the gas tank end panels here that are too long and it doesn't look like they have the correct threads either.

We all know the windshield frame screws are to long.

I've gotten tie rod ends that are too long.

the list just goes on and on.


MG LaVerne

It would be a heck of a lot easier to cut down screws that are way long than to cut ones that are hard to hold.

Doing sheet metal work on Beech Bonanzas years ago every panel was way over sized and had to be trimmed as lots of hand building was done. Similar panels for a Cessna which had closer tolerances and less hand fabrication were often ready to drill.

JE Carroll

I put the left panel on and with a little fudging it bolted up. Naturally their too long and have to be trimmed. Found out the right panel is 1/4 inch taller at the bottom bend all way across! I can fudge the long section that bolts to the side of the chassis, but the little step has to be cut off and raised 1/4 inch to set on top of the chassis and welded in the proper position. The ends are a no brainier, but at near 400 bucks a piece, it's very unsettling to have to modify them for such a stupid mistake. Oh well, such is life in the fast lane! PJ
Paul S Jennings

The last one I did I was so disgusted with the general fit of a new panel that I found it easier to buy a used one, that ended up needing 1/8" more at the front end. I welded on 2", and then cut back to fit, like factory. Worked a charm!

There are just too many variables, wood and metal, in these cars...

Tom Lange
MGT Repair
t lange

Tom, Here's a couple shots of the "craftsmanship" and i use that term very loosely! The upper brackets on the right panel were spot welded as they should be, very well done! But, look at the left side panel brackets! I would like for someone to say, "Oh, this is how it's done"! Judge for your self.
I have to spot weld the screwed up brackets and then grind the garbage welds off. Nice huh. PJ

Paul S Jennings

2,

Paul S Jennings

Here's the other side, the way their supposed to be!



Paul S Jennings

The bad ones look like things when I tried to weld, except there are no holes burned through. Not good QC for sure. George
George Butz

Well, I basically said the hell with it and started to redo the panels to suit me. I have floor mounted shears, metal brake, rollers etc, so I'm not lacking in tools. It just ticks me off I have to do this. On a good note, the weather is really getting nice! Grin. PJ
Paul S Jennings

One of the upper tabs redone. Both now look like this. PJ



Paul S Jennings

Not like this!



Paul S Jennings

This thread was discussed between 18/05/2014 and 20/05/2014

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