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MG TD TF 1500 - Rear Main Oil Seal Conversion - 1500 TF

I am getting prepared to resolve the engine oil leaks on my 1500 TF. This forum has a lot of great info on repairing oil leaks however I could not find specific answers to my questions - so here I go.
I inherited a Moss "Oil Seal Conversion" kit with Moss # 433-415. There is also a label on the box that reads "MG T-Series Rear Engine Oil Seal Kit" "Moss Garage Part # MG863". Based on the instruction included in the box it appears the kit was manufactured some time after 1998 since the "adapter" contains a 45 degree chamfer on the inside surface.
1. My first question is: The kit contains an oil seal that is painted green on the outside circumference and contains the # CR-37388-USA. Is this the correct seal or is there a more recent updated seal that should be used? If so what is the part # and where can it be purchased?
2. With the above kit came a Speedi-Sleeve containing the Moss # 433-425. The Speedi-Sleeve manufacturers # on the box is 99374. Is this the correct Speedi-Sleeve?
3. I have read the new Moss rear oil seal conversion kit now contains a centering fixture which I understand is critical for aligning the seal and crankshaft flange. Can this fixture be purchased separately and from where?
4. Based on what I have read, it appears the 1500 and 1250 crankshafts are the same. Is that a correct assumption?
Thanks and sorry for the long winded question(s)!
Mark Stolzenburg
Chesterfield, Missouri, USA
Mark Stolzenburg

mark, there is a newer version of that seal. i installed my moss seal several years ago..no centering fixture at that time and after having done the install, i do not see the need for one. the part number you have indicates it is one of those mfg. by chicago rawhide for moss. i believe that is a proprietary part, if so you only source is a moss authorized distributor (such as little british car co. who offer all moss parts 15% of..even moss sale prices) or moss direct. use the speedi-sleeve..mount so the seal has proper contact with the speedi sleeve..the sleeve will probably have to be shifted forward slightly on the crankshaft flange rather than centered on the flange.
if someone has recently done this conversion they may loan you the centering fixture..if it is reusable.
i have nothing but good words to say about the seal. on the car 4 seasons and thousands of miles and not a drop of oil.
regards, tom
tom peterson

Huh -- didn't know they'd started including a centering tool. Wish they'd had them when I bought mine in 2012. I found that the seal retainer would have been about 0.007" off-center if I had just run the screws in and let it go. I had to have the tapers for the countersunk screws bored out with flat-bottom counterbores and use socket-head cap screws instead. It took some fiddling but I was able to get it properly centered. I've not put all that many miles on it since I got the engine back together, but it's been since May of this year and I've had *no* oil leak from it! Hope I haven't jinxed myself! ;-)
Rob Edwards

Mark

I carried out this conversion using the new Moss seal on my 1250 TF with the aid of a Licensed Motor Engineer.

The whole experience was a nightmare and still is despite having proven the engine for leaks by bench running it out of the car. Twelve months down the track after no road miles running the engine the proverbial drip raised its ugly head.

My best advice would be bin the Moss kit and take the Chevy seal conversion option, OK it means having some machining done.

In my case I had to face the fly wheel to get sufficient running surface for the Moss seal despite having installed the "Speedi sleeve".

There are a million posts in the archive regarding this subject (including my own) and if you do a Google search you will find plenty of advice and mixed messages on options to cure this problem.

Good luck with what ever option you decide to take.

Graeme
G Evans

mark, as i said, my experience was completely different..no centering needed as the seal "floats" in the attach pieces until the sealant sets up..the crankshaft flange itself centered the seal with in the attach pieces and the permatex blue is allowed to set and you are good to go. best of luck with whatever method you use. i would use this kit again on another engine if needed without hesitation. regards, tom
tom peterson

>the seal "floats" in the attach pieces until the sealant sets up.

Hi Tom -- that doesn't sound at all like the kit I got. On mine the seal is held quite firmly in the retainer. They recommend sealer and I used it, but I'd bet it would work fine without.
Rob Edwards

My favorite T-car guru, Lawrie Alexander, is Moss' go-to guy on this product. I'd suggest contacting him and see what he says. He's Lawrie (at) britcars.com Bud
Bud Krueger

Mark,

Lawrie sent me his centering tool after I talked to him at GOF West. I'm having a copy made and hope to return his this coming Saturday. If you need to borrow one I'll be able to loan you my copy if he can't loan you his.

Gene
Gene Gillam

I'm just quite curious - can you post a picture of the tool?

Thanks.

Jud
J K Chapin

I did mine and found it off center as well. I also had the adapter spot faced and used button head screws to center it. I had to install the sleeve tighter to the block as others have mentioned.

So far with test time only, no leaks. Time will tell. I think a good PCV system would go a long way towards keeping the engine dry. Modern engines so equipped, and with better sealing methods, are bone dry.
J E Carroll

Jud,

It's at my machinist friend's house now...I can post one on Friday,

Gene
Gene Gillam

I mentioned that I had a Chicago Rawhide seal with the part #CR-37388-USA that came with the conversion kit. What is the proper part number of the updated Chicago Rawhide seal that I should be using?
Thanks,
Mark Stolzenburg
Chesterfield, Missouri, USA
Mark Stolzenburg

Mark

I suggest you print and read this doco,

http://www.chicagolandmgclub.com/techtips/mgt/pdf/TT_GA133_Moss_Rear_Seal_Conv_Kit.pdf

Pending the age of your kit you may need to return it to Moss to have them modify it.

Graeme

G Evans

Graeme,

That's actually "old" news - here's the link to the "new" installation guide: http://www.mossmotors.com/graphics/products/Instructions/433-421_980-379_INST.pdf

I notice too that there's a picture of the alignment tool on this link.
Gene Gillam

Gene

The reason I referred Mark to the old set of instructions was because of the reference for returning the old model seal retainer for modification.

Graeme
G Evans

Mark,

The alignment tool is available separately from Moss, it just does not appear online, nor can you order online. Part no is 433-406 and its US$30.00
B W Wood

Does anyone have the new, improved rear seal number?
Thanks,
Mark Stolzenburg
Chesterfield, Missouri, USA
Mark Stolzenburg

Mark,

I can loan you mine if you need it.

Gene
Gene Gillam

This thread was discussed between 11/11/2013 and 23/11/2013

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