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MG TD TF 1500 - Tubes. Yes or No?

A friend has just bought new Firestone F560s for his disc-wheeled TF.

Is there any need for a tube, or will a simple band suffice, or even nothing?

Gord Clark
Rockburn, Qué.
Gord Clark

Absolutely use tubes. I know this will kick off a firestorm of opinion, but with the original design rim, if one loses a little pressure, there is no safety rim to keep the tires in place.
Lew3

Hi Gord,

I've had tubeless radial tires on my TF for over 30 years, not the same set of course, and have never had to use inner tubes or anything else. Just make sure there is no damage, warping, etc. where the bead sits.

However, if the car is going to be raced or driven hard in and out of corners, tubes would be a good insurance policy.

John
John Mitchell

Gord, this is one debate I could never understand. I know tyre technology has moved on from cross (bias) plys to radials. I also know some radials are designed to be run with tubes. Clearly the cars came with wheels that were fitted with tubes, there is extra insurance with tubes & as I've not heard anyone ever articulate a good reason for NOT fitting tubes, except that they run a little hotter & when punctured they deflate a bit faster, just stick 'em in & be done with it, says I. It's not like they're gunner break the bank & they just might save your life. Cheers
Peter TD 5801
P Hehir

Tubeless since 11/23/1971 when dad bought the car. Wow-"when punctured they deflate a bit faster" -that is really so safe! George
George Butz

They don't explode George, just deflate. Pull over change the tyre & get on your way. Cheers
Peter TD 5801
P Hehir



I have been tubeless since 1972, now on Vredestein Sport Classic for three years with out any problem.

Jim

James Neel

Here's my take... I put on tubeless tires and they're fine except the spare kept going flat. Turned out there was a tiny split at the weld. Fix was to put in a tube. The wheels were never built to hold air, so if tubeless works for you it's purely luck. I would advise tubes just so you don't eventually go flat because of air leaks through the wheel welds.
Geoffrey M Baker

Gents,

Discarded bias ply tires with tubes and replaced with tubeless radials about two years ago. No problems so far. As I remember when tubeless became common many American cars, GM and Ford did not run "safety rims". Had to repair tires daily and Chrysler Corp., Plymouth, Dodge Desoto, Chrysler safety rims were a pain. If you race maybe tubes buy you something but I doubt it.

Jim Haskins 1953 TD
J M Haskins

I suppose if the puncture allowed air to make its way to the valve stem hole then yes, a tubed tire could deflate faster. But I've been running tubed tires on one car or another all my life and I don't recall ever having a sudden blowout while running tubes.

The biggest danger is running radials tires on rims not designed for them, since the load on the rim edges are increased beyond what they were designed to handle long term. But obviously radials will ride and handle better as well as being cheaper and more available, so we all run them. Be sure to inspect rims for cracks periodically, especially around the bead area. Tubes or tubeless however, shouldn't make a difference in reliability. Just remember to use tubes designed for radial tires. Tubes not designed for radial use will often rupture when hot, or eventually wear through from abrasion.
Steve Simmons

You don't need the tubes for the tires, YOU NEED TUBES FOR THE RIMS. The TD/TF run tubeless rims.
Been wearing seat belts since 1969, haven't needed them yet...
Be well,
David
D. Sander

Here is a tubeless rim. Note the ribs to hold the tire bead against the lip of the rim. Our rims do not have this rib, necessating the tube.
Be well,
David

D. Sander

Here is a tube type rim. Notice no ribs.
Be well,
David

D. Sander

Dave did you mean to say "The TD/TF run tubeless rims"? I guess that was a typo. I agree with you on the most important consideration & that is that our cars came with wheels that were not designed to be run without tubes. Gord the answer to your question is simple. Fit the tubes as they were designed to be used with our wheels. If you don't want to fit tubes, then buy a set of wheels with rims that are designed to be run without tubes. Like I said I don't understand the debate. Cheers
Peter TD 5801
P Hehir

Oops, yes, I mean to say TD and TF run tube type rims.
Be well,
David
D. Sander

if one is going down the road and a tire goes flat, what does the tube do? I ran no tubes on my TD for over 10 years on the factory rims. Never had a problem. If the tire comes off the rim, that tube will do nothing.it will not support anything, You would just run on the rim a few seconds and then poof the tube would be cut buy the rim and the road.
TRM Maine

I always run tubes. Why not? It is a little harder to get a flat repaired, but as our cars were built to run tubes. I see no reason not to.
Bruce TD4139 Cunha

Tubeless rims have a ring on the inside of each lip to mechanically hold the tire on the rim, preventing quick and unintended deflation. Without this ring, running a tube type rim without tubes results in a quick, unexpected deflation in the event of the sidewall being drawn away from the lip of the rim. How can this happen? If the tire is not fully inflated, and or the tire hits a pot hole, curb or is exposed to aggressive driving it will fold and immediately deflate. How much warning will you have? Less than a 1/10 of a second.
Will a properally inflated tire running without a tube suddenly deflate while driving in a straight line down down a smooth paved road? Probably not. Why take a chance? Who hasn't swerved to avoid an obstacle, hit a bump, bumped a curb or noticed a tire was soft? Anyone?
Be well,
David.
D. Sander

Totally agree David! A concise & cogent argument for tubes on original rims. The only question I'd ask your buddy Gord is whether the Firestone F 560's that he's purchased are designed to be run with tubes. If not hopefully he can swap them for Firestones that are, assuming that they do make them. Cheers
Peter TD 5801
P Hehir

David has good arguments.

New tires have ripples inside - the old tires have been smooth. While moving the ripples interact with the tube. Therefore it is urgent to use talcum.
Bela

I attended a tire and wheel seminar yesterday. Often wire wheels are not true, necessating tire shaving to ensure a continuous radius from the mounted center through the tread of the tire.
Mounting tires, it is important to check the inside of the tire, AND REMOVE ALL STICKERS AND LABELS. These will abrade a tube and cause pin holes. If you have one tire leak, you will more than likely have three more. Some tires will have sharp ribs that need to be scuffed down with a sanding disk, but this is rare.
Mount the tire, and tube with talcum powder. Pump the tire up enough to ensure it has the proper shape, and bounce it hard several times. Deflate the tire and then inflate. The talcum powder acts as a lubricant, and bouncing, deflating and rein flaring insures the tube has no folds.
If set up correctly, there are really no issues with wheels on our cars.
Be well,
David
D. Sander

Good advice from you all.

Its now clear, at least to me, that tubes are the safe way to go.

David, your pix make it that much more clear.

Thanks.

Gord Clark
Rockburn, Qué.
Gord Clark

This thread was discussed between 08/04/2016 and 11/04/2016

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