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MG TD TF 1500 - water outlet on head ?

The water outlet I have has a brass pipe coming out of it. My first thoughts were that it was a standard part for the heater. Is it? or is this part modified? If this is original part, what would the pipe thread be? I need to get a plug for now. Plan to install the rear heater from my Chry mini van when I scrap it out.

Thanks

RER Rosa

RER - That is a previous owner modification, probably for a heater. The pipe appears to be about 1/4" copper pipe which would make the threads 1/4 NPT (American pipe thread). Cheers - Dave
David DuBois

Looks like someone just drilled & tapped your casting for, what appears to be, 1/2" NPT.

If you're in the Ann Arobr area, I'll give you a brass plug for now, and help you plumb your heater when you get around to it.

JIM
JRN JIM

It's non-standard, so you need to measure..

But it's good you already have it, so you have a head start for the installation.

Rgds, Mike
Mike Fritsch

RER,
I use that location for my thermocouple instead of the radiator tank. Before the thermostat opens the water in the engine and the water in the radiator are very different. I choose to monitor the engine temperature.
All my heater connections are on the right side of the engine.
Mort

Mort Resnicoff 50 TD (Mobius)

Thanks for the info Gents. I live in the corn fields of Kawkawlin, MI. I like the idea of putting the thermocouple there. What thread is on the thermocouple? It looks like I might have to come up with something special to adapt 1/4 NPT to British pipe thread? I was concerned that the brass pipe might be British pipe thread so thought I best ask. I'll have to plug the hole on the radiator also?

Jim. My son will be passing thru Ann Arbor on Sunday or Monday 22nd or 23rd. He used to live on Packard. I know I can come up with a American NPT plug but not sure about the British version. Your offer is greatly appreciated. If your cruising up I75. I'm just off the Beaver Rd exit. Your assistance anytime would be great. I've done fairly well with this restoration until now. Been stuck with several technical issues or missing hard to find parts.

Thanks

Bob
RER Rosa

Hey Mort. Now all we need to do is figure out a way to install a tap for BOTH the heater and the thermocouple! We could have our cake and eat it too!
Jim Merz

Bob, Dave,Mike, Mort, Jim,
I'm sure you'll find that's a standard, good, old US National Pipe Tapered thread. If you're in a hurry to fill it with coolant, take your nipple to Lowes or Home Depot and score a plug for less than a buck. You might check in the brass fittings section, first.
I can root around for the fittings with the correct thread to adapt the bulb. This issue is, I can't guarantee it won't leak, as the bulb seats into the fitting, instead of using tapered threads that tighten down. I can dig up an O-ring or something once I check out the hardware. Fortunately, TDs have a nonpressurized cooling system.
Earlier this year, I had to fabricate a hose-barb fitting with the machine threads to thread into a stock TF elbow, and collect about 5 lbs of fittings to EITHER tap the heater and bulb off the stock TF elbow, or just come off the elbow with the hose and utilize a Tee clamped into the hose to adapt the temp gauge close to the firewall.
This cobbling up fittings is never fun!
When you're ready for the heater, there's a ton of info in the archives here. I'm attaching a picture of original Arnolt bypass fitting and routing.

JRN JIM

Once you're temp gauge is installed, you can just run your heater off the "bypasselbow" for a clean installation. If you have a later style thermostat, or no stat at all, your bypass circuit is goofed up, anyway.
I turned the thermostat housing around and came off the generator side. I tried to upload an image of it, but the file is too large, later!!!
JRN JIM

Just submitting an illustration of reversing stat housing and running heater hose back. It is just one option. The heater return hose comes back into the bypass branch at the pump intake on the other side.
That cotton covered hose has since been replace with thinner, conventional heater hose. There may, or may not be enough room for this with the temp gauge threaded into the elbow. It'd be close. As I said, just one option.

JRN JIM

Jim, I chose to leave the original design of the cooling system alone with respect to the thermostat bypass. But I copied the MG TF system and simply added an outlet for the hottest coolant to feed my heater. What I was referring to in my comment to Mort was that all we have to do now is get our engine temperature reading from this same location.

Jim Merz

Bob,
Measure your nipple. Hopefully, it'll be around .675" for 3/8" nominal pipe size.
Refer to the image. I fashioned up an adapter for the combo water temp/oil pressure gauge pictured using a brass 3200-06-06 reducing connector (Parker designation 222P-06-06) which is a male pipe thread and a female pipe thread. I drilled it out just a touch
so the bulb slips through and slipped an 013 O-ring on for the seal. The nut threads in fine and snugs down nicely.
However, that gauge does not fit in either of the TD's radiators in the garage- they are just threaded holes with no shoulder to seat the bulb. I've never used the radiator for the water temperature so I'm not sure what original TDs had. I made a makeshift plug for the one radiator long ago from a pipe thread, (brass pipe plugs goes in a few turns and would do in a pinch). It looks like the other radiator has a BSPP plug size 6 (9522-06).
I have that brass 3200-06-06 reducing connector, and a brass pipe plug (if you want to just plug it off) ready for pickup. They're from some inventory that might be 50 years old, but they polished up and look like 24k gold.
If you're in a hurry, you can order the fittings for a few bucks + shipping and get them next day. It's up to you to drill out the fitting and come up with an O-ring or maybe get by with silicone seal or whatever.

Sorry- the urls posted do not link to the supplier's webpage....

more to follow...

JRN JIM

back again...
To get fittings quick, Google up Pressure Connections, and in the quick order pad on the left, enter:

3200-06-06 quantities 1
9522-06 quantities 1
3152-06 quantities 1

Bob,
I agree, get hot water for heater and temp gauge from the front. There's more than one way to skin a cat. You can always drill & tap the elbow like Bob's. He has the option of the tapped elbow for temp and the bypass for heater source.
Tom Booth says he's running the hose back from his TF tapped elbow to the firewall and installing the Tee assembly I whipped up, for the temp gauge, so the capillary tube doesn't run all the way up front. I furnished enough fittings where the bulb could've been Tee'd right off the thermostat elbow in the heater hose circuit.
I ran the a hose from the bypass elbow to beneath the dash where the bulb (with small bypass) and a heater shutoff valve are concealed.
Unless an old thermostat with sleeve is still in use (Tom's TF!) the bypass circuit doesn't function as designed. Arnolt's fitting works great with newer thermostats, but ironically, the old sleeve would cut heater flow by the time the engine warms up!

JRN JIM

Great info Jim. Thanks! I'm not in any kind of a hurry. I have more technical problems to get solved first then when spring'r weather gets here I hope to be ready to fill the cooling system and fire up for the first time. I know there are a lot of things I need to check out and make sure they are working correctly before trying to fire up. Just dropped below 10 degrees here tonight. Your help will be greatly appreciated. I've read many of the posts on heaters and hook ups. When I bought my engine head it came with a plate on the back end that someone had added a port for the heater hook up. I'll post a photo next time. It looks like a possible good way to use. From what I think I remember seeing the return has to feed into the lower return lines of the cooling system? I think the Chry rear heater package I'm planning to use has the shutoff valve, fan motor all included. I'd be glad to buy your fittings. If not I'll go on line. I'll measure the pipe and let you know.

Mort that is a nice clean looking set up. It is what I'd like to do.

Thanks
Bob
RER Rosa

RER,
My engine came with a heater tap at the back of the head also. There have been many threads about where to connect for the heater. The back of the head seems to be the least desirable. I have replaced the plate.
Mort
Mort Resnicoff 50 TD (Mobius)

If anybody would like it, I have a rear head plate with an outlet on it. It came on 'the53' and is a freebee. Bud
Bud Krueger

Thanks Mort! Sounds like I'll have a plate to get rid of also. I made a new solid plate that is on the head now.
RER Rosa

...used one of those temp guns when i changed over to the front elbow heater connection to see what temps were around the engine.....

gblawson(gordon- TD27667)

This thread was discussed between 11/12/2013 and 14/12/2013

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