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MG TD TF 1500 what kind of Bold is it? BBS discussion at MG-Cars.info
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MG TD TF 1500 - what kind of Bold is it?
| What kind of Bold is it? I found it underneath the engine in the drain pan. But I have no idea where to fit 
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| GK Guenter |
| Can you measure the thread size of the bolt. |
| R A WILSON |
| Meant to say, if it is SI (Morris/MG) metric, then it might be from the engine (unlikely) or gearbox (improbable). If it is imperial, it might be from the carburettors. Was it lying to any particular side or end of the engine? Do you have a bulkhead fitting that is suddenly loose? |
| R A WILSON |
| Clutch stop bolt in the pedal box?? |
| PJ Jennings |
| Is it a one piece bolt or nut on stud? Looks like accelerator mounting block stud w/ pot metal broken off and nut on end. |
| George Butz |
| Thank you George, it's a nut on stud. Bold dia 1/4" length 7/8" thread pitch 1/32" or can be 1mm nut hex 7/18" 
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| GK Guenter |
| Geuenter. I have never seen that bolt or stud in my td. I have had the hole engine and gearbox in pieces ,and has not seen a stud like that. Thoralf. NORWAY TD 4490 |
| Thoralf Sorensen (TD4490) |
| Thank you Thoralf for your comment, but it is a matter of fact that the part was in the Dripping pan underneath the engine. A second matter of fact is that never ever was another car was on this particular parking space. cheers, guenter |
| GK Guenter |
| If the bolt diameter of 1/4" is actually 6mm, and the pitch is 1mm, then the thread could be SI 6mm standard**, and would be in the metric thread series used on Morris, MG and Wolseley engines and gearboxes. If you have an 8mm MG bolt or stud, they also have 1mm pitch, so see if the threads mesh together. If so, then the stud could have come from your engine or gearbox - just have to think of the location. However, in the current ISO metric threads, 6mm coarse also has a 1mm pitch, although you say that no other, particularly modern, car has been in that space.
** sometimes called coarse. |
| R A WILSON |
| sorry, Mr. Wilson, but the diameter is 6.35mm it is not 6.00. A metric 6mm screw will NOT fit on the bold. |
| GK Guenter |
| Looks like some sort of "pinch" bolt drawing or holding some other round object into a locked position. Like the distributor "cotterbolt" (Moss #433-540) but your picture doesn't quite look it. Randy |
| R Biallas |
| Perhaps it is Unified Screw Thread extra fine; 1/4" dia x 32 tpi. I wonder where that was used ? |
| R A WILSON |
| You are correct on both points Randy. I have the cotterbolt on my TF and this thing isn't it. There are very few studs on a T car. The only thing I can think of that is even close to this size in or near the engine compartment is the single stud on the pedal box cover. |
| L E D LaVerne |
| Hi, I would agree with George, it is possible the bolt out of one of the two mounting blocks that hold the accelerator shaft across the bulkhead. They go though into the engine bay, and are unique to LHD. If one block is broken or the shaft so worn that this could come out it could be quite dangerous to drive. |
| B W Wood |
| Perhaps it is not a part from your MG. There is a special hidden place between the front fender and the chassis frame where such a bolt can remain for years before falling on ground. I found a bolt in this place in my TD. Your bolt may be part of a tool that was suspended above the engine and it fell into the hidden place years ago. Think about a part of a lamp or a special wrench... Laurent. |
| LC Laurent31 |
| Scaling from the second photo, I think it is closer to 1/4" UNF, which has 28 tpi, and is a bit more common than Unified extra fine. Still unsure where it came from. |
| R A WILSON |
| Sorry, Guenther, you might check your bike for a missing threaded bolt:). Does not look like anything normaly used on a TD that came my way within the past MG TD decade... Ralph TD 19435 |
| R.S. Ralph Siebenhaar |
Best picture I could do with phone. This is a cracked pedal shaft mounting block. Note the raised lip at the bottom. That would perfectly fit the indentation in the mystery bolt- to keep it from rotating when tightening the nut. Also hole is 1/4". I vaguely recall removing the same bolt from the toe plate on a car some years back that the mounting block had broken away from, pretty sure that is what you have. No clue how it ended up in your pan? George
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| George Butz |
| Could it possibly be a broken stud from the throttle peddle shaft to toe board mountings? There are two and the stud would have fallen from the front of the firewall and down either side of the block casting at the flywheel and landed near the backside of the engine into your drip pan Bill Chasser TD-4834 |
| W A Chasser |
| Wow - Bill Chaser is right he is the TD Expert of the day! Thank you Bill. As you said there are 2 of them at the firewall. One of them is located near to the steering shaft on my LH Driven TD. Actual this bold is missing during the Next days I have to remove the under-dash plywood plate to get access to the location to check if the cracked pedal shaft mounting block is the issue as George Butz said. Thank you my friends for your help. I will keep you informed. Cheers, Guenter |
| GK Guenter |
| Have somebody such a block at hand and can make a sketch with measurements for me? I do not have actual access to my car and I would like to make a pair of the blocks to be prepared before I can remove the under dash panel. Thank you Guenter 
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| GK Guenter |
| Guenter. I believe the blocks are inserted onto the shaft and then the shaft was bent into shape. I have one out in the shed somewhere. I will try to hunt it up tomorrow if someone else doesn’t post ahead of me. It’s a spare but you can probably find one over on your side of the pond for a reasonable cost. Bill Chasser TD-4834 |
| W A Chasser |
| The blocks are made of pot metal and are cast on the stud. The notch is to keep the stud from pulling out or turning when tighting the nut. You can't replace them without strating the shaft. Not something you don't want to do and even if you did both ends have something on them. The roller end has a bracket for the roller welded to it and the other end is flattend for a hole for the link to the carbs. To repair this I made new a new two piece block out of alum. Clamp two pieces together and drill hole for the shaft through the seam and drill 1/4" hole though bough parts while still clamped together for a bolt where the stud was and bolt in place with the shaft between your new two part block. Don't forget to oil them. I would send a drawing but am using a I-pad as I'am in a hospital at the time. Hope to get out soon. Forrest TD/C 22679 |
| Forrest Rubenstein |
| It is a cotter bolt for locking the distributor i XPAW i.e. Wolseley Engines. |
| Y Strom |
| Thank you, Forrest, that's exactly what I feared, the parts do not exist as a spare part.
I will follow your description and make a two-part block myself, maybe from sinter bronze like Oilite. I hope you get well soon all my best wishes from this side of the pond. In the mean time I hope on Bill that he can find this acceleration bar in his workshop and can provide some measurements and may be a photograph from the parts. @ Bill Chasser Bill it would be a great help it you can find the bar and you can give me the major measurements of the block. As I said, I'm unable to get access to my car it is on winter store. But I like to be prepared for the coming spring period. Thank you all for your help! Cheers, Guenter |
| GK Guenter |
| Look in the archives or in Bud's T-talk- I recall someone had a drawing of the "sandwich" block. I can measure my broken original in the picture further up the thread as well later today. George |
| George Butz |
| As there is a stud like this locking the distributer in XPAWs, it possible to drop it in the hole for the distributor when the distributor is out. May I ask if you have an XPAG or XPAW. The XPAG, at least mine, has a big MG cast at the front left on the block, under the tappet cover. There might also be a sign of a blocked hole for the dip stick on the right side, if it has been moved to the left side. |
| YS Strom |
| Guenter. Send me your email at the link above and I will see if I can dig it up for you. Most of my pics won’t download on this site due to size Bill Chasser TD-4834 |
| W A Chasser |
| Success!
Today I was able to get access to my TD and further I was able to remove the fragments of the brackets from the acceleration bar. I use a small 1/16 jobber to drill holes crosswise into the blocks and with a screw driver I could break the blocks into two parts. Now I have it in hand and can take the measures I need to make new blocks in form as a “sandwich” block. I have to make decision what kind of material I should use for this job. I would prefer brass for it. To drill the main hole 3/8” and drilling a ¼” UNF crosswise for the mysterious bolt, which should be inserted using Loctite. Thank you all for your help! Cheers, Guenter |
| GK Guenter |
| Guenter, I would suggest either tapping your block and threading it in (ie a threaded stud), or using a through bolt with a nut. As the original was cast around the bolt with the notch/matching protrusion in the casting, I don't think Locktite will hold it in well enough. See the 5th post in the thread- it has likely been years since I have seen that part, so you guys can tell my wife (who says I can't remember anything she tells me more than 5 minutes) my memory is really fine! haha. George |
| George Butz |
| The bolt can be seen as item 182 i the drawing below. http://www.mgccyregister.co.uk/technical-information/miscellaneous/fitting-an-xpaw-engine/?doing_wp_cron=1511122936.4105949401855468750000 It can of corse also be used in many other aplications. |
| YS Strom |
| I must agree with George to a certain extent. If I were going to fabricate the piece I would split a raw block in half first. Then drill two holes the appropriate size to run a 1/4 BSF tap and thread the holes while it is still firmly clamped. You can do one hole at a time but fill it with a bolt before moving on to the next hole. This will facilitate the hole alignment so you don’t jam the tap. Once both holes have been threaded and bolts snugged into place you can flip the block and drill the hole for the shaft. Keep in mind that you probably won’t have a perfect alignment for the shaft in relation to the other mounting block which may require you to open the hole a little bit further. You don’t want it to bind in any way. Replace one of the bolts with a longer one to act as your toeboard stud. The reason why I recommend threading both holes as it will allow the through bolt to remain in place as you push it through the toeboard for assembly. In essence it will function exactly as the original stud. Good luck with your project
Bill Chasser TD-4834 |
| W A Chasser |
| Here is also the cotter bolt shown on a XPAG as item 42. https://mossmotors.com/mg-tc-td-tf/engine-performance/external-engine-3 |
| YS Strom |
| Wrong bolt, YS https://mossmotors.com/cotter-clamp-bolt-distributor?assoc=25423 |
| Gene Gillam |
| Thank you YS, but this it not the bold I talk about. The clamp for the distributor is much bigger, about 1/2" dia. The bolt I talk about have 1/4" dia. Anyway, thanks for help. Guenter |
| GK Guenter |
| Guenter In my XPAW the stud has a 1/4" thread and the bolt is marginaly bigger. Can´t measure it as my TD is 120 km from here, but I will measure it when I get there. It is certainly not 1/2" May I ask what the dia is of your bolt. |
| YS Strom |
| The dizzy clamping carter bolt found on later TDs is longer close to 2" or 50mm long. Also the raidus of the notch is much larger to fit the part of the dizzy that goes into the block. The drain pan Guenter is talking about is on his floor to keep oil off the floor. Not the oil pan. I have one under mine also. Forrest TD/C 22679 |
| Forrest Rubenstein |
Yes, you are right Forrest. |
| YS Strom |
| Dear friends, I made a set of new bearing blocks for the acceleration shaft. I used a piece of Bronze. Thank you for all your support and recommendations, Cheers, Guenter 
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| GK Guenter |
| GK, you have done great work, thinking of going into business? Love it. Peter |
| P G Gilvarry |
| Thank you Peter for the Flowers. It is not for business but if somebody will need that block I will be happy to help. |
| GK Guenter |
This thread was discussed between 17/11/2017 and 23/11/2017
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